It makes sense for Amazon since they make money on all the packages. I would guess that purchases made through Google would likely be free at BufferBox.
FWIW, they were charging $3/package for their initial launch at UWaterloo, and people were actually paying for it. You're right - probably not enough people for it to be feasible, but yeah, even some of us ('poor' students) were paying for it.
I would pay that in a heartbeat. Living in an apartment is a nightmare for receiving packages. I hate getting the missed package slip and then having to call and arrange for me to pick up the package at their facility 20 minutes away. I've had to wait 2 hours at the sorting facility for them to find my package before.
So to me, $3 seems like a steal when faced with all that.
Our apartment is awful for receiving packages... UPS and FedEx can't even get in the front gate. But I just get packages sent to work, so there's not a problem at all.
If you're a company like BufferBox, the best possible thing to happen to you would be to get acquired by another company, and Google is probably second or third best behind a company already in the logistics industry.
Logistics is hard, and I don't say that about a lot of things.
This doesn't sound like an aquihire where the product usually dies and the team disperses. Sounds like a regular acquisition - ie Google wants the team to continue working on their product but have it integrated with the rest of Google.
Congrats on the team, to me it sounds like Google wants BB to become a major point of contact between Google and it's customers.
DHL "Packstation" started 10 years ago here in Germany, now those boxes are everywhere in populated areas. I was somewhat surprised that it isn't popular in the US.
Funny that you would say that. There are a lot of us start ups (even yc ones!) that copy companyies/ideas that are proven and established here in Germany. The package stuff s just one example. All the ride sharing start ups that were hyped some time ago basically copy "mitfahrgelegenheit.de" ( now the company s known as carpooling) wh have been dong this for nearly ten years now. Public bike sharing is another example.
It's easy to just blame rocket Internet and pretend like that's all of German innovation/startp scene. Packaging and bike sharing weren't even pioneered by startups but by huge formerly state owned companies who are Slow and boring n the Public eye
I agree that Germany is not all about copycats. Thanks to the Samwers and others this perception was created. If you visit places like Silicon Valley and say you're from Germany you can be sure to find someone who will "make a joke" about Germany and startup copycats.
What irritates me is that nobody seems to point out these reverse cases, where others copy German innovation/ideas.
Also I'm wondering why these positive German examples didn't really scale internationally? Why didn't DHL roll out Packstation in the US? (Big company policies and lack of innovation?) Why has Mitfahrgelegenheit/Carpooling needed almost 8 years to launch in Europe? Why hasn't it launched in the US?
Just really wondering about the different perception and mindsets of US and German startups...
Germans are pretty conservative. There was a successful German startup that I looked at, that bragged about how cash flow positive they were. I said FFS, why? In the US in a high growth startup land grab type business, you would put all the cash back into the business to grow it as fast as possible, including internationally, instead of hoarding it and bragging about how solid and conservative you are.
Different values? Maybe they're happy with what they've got and don't need to risk it all for a very small improvement in their already fantastic lifestyle? I'm not criticizing founders who decide to go for it all, but I definitely wouldn't look down on a small but successful business like their clueless.
I personally find the profitable and sustainable business model way more attractive than the grow for the sake of growth model.
In my limited experience, DHL in the US (formerly Airborne Express) doesn't know its ass from its elbow, and is a shambling testament to union sloth and inefficiency. Perhaps things are different in DE?
The big difference between Rocket & BufferBox/Amazon is the implementation of the idea. Rocket doesn't just take an awesome idea and bring it home, they CLONE the initial product, usually copying layout and look & feel. It's this cloning action that draws the ire of the tech world, not the fact that they take international ideas and implement them locally.
How does the security of BufferBox/Amazon Locker compare to Packstation?
To get your packet out of a Packstation, you need both the (magnetic strip) card that they send you on signup and a one-time PIN they send via SMS (not email). This might not sound "easy", but there has been a lot of abuse in the past years so that DHL was forced to step up security.
How do the US systems compare? Have there been reports on abuse?
For Bufferbox, when the package is delivered to the box, they send you an email with an access code, and you have to enter the access code. As far as build quality and strength, they seem pretty solid, and I haven't heard of any abuse stories from the Bufferbox guys.
For Packstation they had some serious problems with phishing. At first you only needed your Packstation User Number and the PIN. They then disallowed logins with user number and required the membership card. But it seems they started skimming those, so starting from last month they send you a TAN to your cellphone when the package arrives and you need card+TAN.
From what I see Bufferbox right now only has a few locations, for Packstation its over 2500 locations and a wide userbase, as with software: the wider the user-base the bigger the profit for bad guys.
Most e-mail users are using browser-based e-mail clients over HTTPS so in order to access the plaintext email one needs to tap the senders local network which would only work if the sender is not using an HTTPS webmail. Plaintext public internet attacks for email were more common when people used unsecured POP3 and IMAP.
I wouldn't call it solid: All that the 'bad guy' needs to go shopping with a stolen CC is control over an email box of a BufferBox customer. DHL had to learn it the hard way, and I'm sure they didn't come up with two factor authentication (card+pin knowledge) and out-of-band (SMS) PIN transmission without a reason. We'll see how it works out in the US..
in japan, it is even more prevalent to some extend than in germany. e.g., amazon will ship to any convenience store for you to pick your parcel up. raktuen etc. as well!
and there are way, way more convenience stores in japan than anything else (apart from vendin machines :))!
...and it seems an amazingly efficient service: no real infrastructure required (packages are on a shelf behind the counter), last-mile shipping done on the same trucks that restock the stores, uses the existing store computer systems, etc.
The "locker model" might be better for high-value goods and an untrustworthy workforce, but it seems to require a pretty huge investment to get any significant coverage...
Yes, well, P.O. boxes have been around since time immemorial too. In this case, the hard part isn't the idea of "a place where people can have stuff shipped that isn't their home address". It's handling the logistics, interfacing with online retailers, etc. It would be a lot more interesting if you could show BufferBox copying some specific, non-obvious technique.
Yes, I understand that well. That doesn't conflict with anything I said unless you think that the crucial insight of the German packstation was to share boxes.
The same was launched and failed in the same place (Toronto) in the year 2000, with locations at Go and Subway stations. I think Google will want to change the business model radically in some way.
One of the best possible outcomes: very cool new business idea, continues operating, backed by Google, with founders compensated for the risk they took launching it. Awesome news. Congratulations!
As silly as tptacek's response was, the bigger take-away from your comment is that pg needs to take it easy with the trigger finger. The moderation here is ridiculous.
I felt that it was a silly and a sarcastic reply and I sure hope its not hell-ban worthy of tptacek or anyone for that matter. Especially on Friday.
Everyone just needs to take it a bit easier (c)
I don't know about you but I want to see a buffer box setup where one of the lockers just says "I'm feeling Lucky" :-)
Edit: and given a game of chance, and games in general. I wonder if anyone at Google has considered combining BufferBox with Ingress such that as you're playing the game if you 'win' a power up it is in the form of Google schwag in a locker, where the open code and which locker appears on your augmented reality glasses to claim your 'prize'.
Where were these services during the Cold War era? I could imagine endless movie scripts of sending secret packages of stolen material prototypes etc. via these services. I guess drug lords and assassins might still be able to use them :)
But the implication is that you might be under further surveillance in your hotel room. However you can slip out at night and get your package. Instead of going to a "trusted house" or some old bookseller you go to one of these services.
Congrats for sure. Now let's speculate on what Google will do with them? Are they going to get into online retail and compete with Amazon? Will Google be able collect data on what is stored in the compartments? Any other ideas?
Yes, and I did. But typically a well-written article will actually explain what they're talking about without assuming the reader knows all the background details.
Incredibly happy for Mike, Jay, Aditya and the rest of the BufferBox Team! It seems like it is getting better and better for Canadian, and in particular Kitchener-Waterloo areas.
One of the other cool things is that I've had my desk at the Velocity Garage right next to theirs for the past month, and I only heard of the news this morning.
>Google is experimenting with a service that would let folk find goods online, order them and have them delivered within a day for a modest fee. This seems similar to Amazon’s hugely successful “Prime” service, which costs $79 a year to join in America. Rather than try to replicate the e-commerce giant’s extensive network of warehouses, Google is looking for partnerships with shipping companies and retailers instead.
I'm excited to see what Google can do. Amazon dominates e-commerce so well I'll often buy from them even if there are cheaper options elsewhere (because it's easier). Competition, as usual, will be good in this space.
Self-driving cars + robot arm + bufferbox = extremely cheap, fully automated delivery service. Add a robotic distribution center http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fdd6sQ8Cbe0 and you have an automated Amazon competitor. If, on top of that, Google turns your Google account into a bank account, you'll be able to buy literally with one click. Google's dominance in mobile with Android will ensure that everyone has a Google bank account through which you can make most of your purchases. If you're a manufacturer, Google will take care of all your advertising for free, just so long as you give them a tiny cut of each sale. Google will be a trillion dollars company.
As tongue in check as this post seems to me I actually think this is one possible way that things could go. I see massive disruption in the next 10 years in regards to the amounts of jobs that could easily become irrelevant once this sort of tech matures. It will be a very interesting space to watch. A Google + Uber partnership could be very kewl as well. We could get our goods, our transportation, internet and knowledge all from the an advertising company. Frightening and exciting at the same time. I think we live in very interesting times.
But at that point, would Google continue to be an advertising company? It would be like one of those megacorps that you see in movies, but hopefully not evil.
Too late, the hive mind which is $GOOG has already shown that it will do as it pleases; "hopefully" good [when convenient], otherwise whatever is profitable even if it is evil.
Can't say I blame the $GOOG; this is an inherent problem with huge organizations -- the meta consciousness which emerges vastly undermines any altruistic desires of individuals.
I am not sure why you need a google bank account to do one click buying with them. You can literally buy almost anything with google checkout and wallet (conditionally the merchant supports them)
Right. What I should have emphasized is that the banking system will be provided entirely by Google. The credit card companies will be out of the equation.
This actually seems like something that happen in the near future. I guess the biggest hurdle to get over first would be laws and regulations for self-driving cars, I'm sure if that were out of the way, within a year or two this would be possible.
I'd like even more to see Self-driving van with bufferbox in the back. A mobile self-driving bufferbox if you want, that comes where you are. You schedule the delivery via a web/mobile interface, car arrives, you go, put in the one-time security code and get your package just like a normal bufferbox but at your home!
Thought it was a great idea along with Amazon Lockers. Just did not know they would be acquired that quick!
Any hints as to the financial terms of the acquisition?
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[ 3.0 ms ] story [ 199 ms ] threadWow, not sure that was ever going to be feasible. Won't be an issue now that Google bought them. Good for them!
So to me, $3 seems like a steal when faced with all that.
Logistics is hard, and I don't say that about a lot of things.
Congrats on the team, to me it sounds like Google wants BB to become a major point of contact between Google and it's customers.
Welcome to the future, America. I'd be happy to see what a startup under Google can do, but the competition isn't exactly asleep.
Who would have thought that an idea that exists in Germany for almost 10 years would still be great for a startup in the US/Canada.
It's easy to just blame rocket Internet and pretend like that's all of German innovation/startp scene. Packaging and bike sharing weren't even pioneered by startups but by huge formerly state owned companies who are Slow and boring n the Public eye
What irritates me is that nobody seems to point out these reverse cases, where others copy German innovation/ideas.
Also I'm wondering why these positive German examples didn't really scale internationally? Why didn't DHL roll out Packstation in the US? (Big company policies and lack of innovation?) Why has Mitfahrgelegenheit/Carpooling needed almost 8 years to launch in Europe? Why hasn't it launched in the US?
Just really wondering about the different perception and mindsets of US and German startups...
I personally find the profitable and sustainable business model way more attractive than the grow for the sake of growth model.
You could end up #1 in Germany against a #2 who is #1 in the rest of the EU - when by moving faster you could have been #1 in the entire EU.
P.S. I'm defining industrial as 'the manipulation and enrichment of physical goods' for the purpose of this comment.
To get your packet out of a Packstation, you need both the (magnetic strip) card that they send you on signup and a one-time PIN they send via SMS (not email). This might not sound "easy", but there has been a lot of abuse in the past years so that DHL was forced to step up security.
How do the US systems compare? Have there been reports on abuse?
From what I see Bufferbox right now only has a few locations, for Packstation its over 2500 locations and a wide userbase, as with software: the wider the user-base the bigger the profit for bad guys.
The "locker model" might be better for high-value goods and an untrustworthy workforce, but it seems to require a pretty huge investment to get any significant coverage...
I didn't think he felt seriously offensed by the comment pointing out that the idea wasn't new.
The downvotes, well, those are, strictly speaking, justified. :)
Maybe you expected him/her to be excited about the exit but that not being the case does not mean you should have repled with 'rude sarcasm'.
You could have used the opportunity you used to respond to learn about competitors in the space however you chose this route.
I have noticed several senior (by karma) HN members that take an unecessary offensive approach towards comments that do not "tow the line".
We know you have FU money now but please remember that that expression is supposed to be figurative and not literal.
Edit: and given a game of chance, and games in general. I wonder if anyone at Google has considered combining BufferBox with Ingress such that as you're playing the game if you 'win' a power up it is in the form of Google schwag in a locker, where the open code and which locker appears on your augmented reality glasses to claim your 'prize'.
This could be awesome. Congrats guys. Look forward to seeing what the future holds.
>Google is experimenting with a service that would let folk find goods online, order them and have them delivered within a day for a modest fee. This seems similar to Amazon’s hugely successful “Prime” service, which costs $79 a year to join in America. Rather than try to replicate the e-commerce giant’s extensive network of warehouses, Google is looking for partnerships with shipping companies and retailers instead.
I'm excited to see what Google can do. Amazon dominates e-commerce so well I'll often buy from them even if there are cheaper options elsewhere (because it's easier). Competition, as usual, will be good in this space.
http://www.shoprunner.com/trial/free-shipping-best-stores.ph...
And FedEx Store (what used to be Kinko's) is pitching their network to retailers as well, I picked up a bunch of Walmart.com there.
Not sure it's going to be that big of a game changer.
Too late, the hive mind which is $GOOG has already shown that it will do as it pleases; "hopefully" good [when convenient], otherwise whatever is profitable even if it is evil.
Can't say I blame the $GOOG; this is an inherent problem with huge organizations -- the meta consciousness which emerges vastly undermines any altruistic desires of individuals.
See also: $MS, $AAPL, $USGOV, et al.