Guess the japanese excel at micromanaging. Although one could
say that the research here in the article is more epic than
Shinya's discovery, but I remember having watched one of his
presentation and it convinced me of pure epicness, if you
understand how his team found the "Yamanaka factors". That
was by human (work) consistency. About as epic as
Christiane Nüsslein-Volhard and her mutant screens, that also
involved tons of micro-experiments.
That can't be good. Life cycle of a human egg is organized around preserving mitochondria to be as young and fresh as possible across generations. Using adult cell, even a stem cell to make an egg probably gives it mitochondrial damage that usually takes hundreds of human generations to accumulate.
The origins of stem cells for use in the biosciences and in cosmetics are extremely brutal and should be illegal. Sandra Bullock explains it better than I could:
https://youtu.be/PwO3TEj9-5g
I am worried about the long term impact of research involving human conception, IVF, etc.
The reason is that genetics/evolution don't yet seem to fully explain how humans exist. A computer genetic algorithm run for a billion generations doesn't lead to anything anywhere near the the complexity of a human.
I suspect there are as-yet undiscovered effects which shape the next generation. Whether that be DNA methylation, gut bacteria passing from mother to child, selection of the 'correct' egg or sperm out of millions, or something new and un-discovered etc.
And if those effects are bypassed with artificial conception, we might end up with humans which aren't as strong, aren't as smart, aren't as well adapted to a changing environment, etc.
The effect will be small for each generation, but after 5-10 generations of a combination of artificial and natural conception you could end up with meaningful loss of fitness - or perhaps a lack of gain of fitness that would have otherwise occurred.
By contrast, we could also end up with humans that are stronger, smarter, or are better adapted to a changing environment.
In routine IVF, parents select for the strongest embryo to implant. This cannot happen in the case of traditional embryo development, where the released egg meets the sperm.
The assumption that IVF could produce weaker humans is an assumption rooted in what? Sci fi?
Imagine guys like Musk, Bezos, Zuckerberg or Thiel cloning themselves. That's 100% dystopian. We would never be able to get rid of madmen! Power corrupts and makes the powerful just weird and unable to make rational decisions. That's why people in power need to be replaced regularly to have a stable society.
That is a good question. Excepting the sexual ones, all the cells in an organism are diploid¹, including the ones found in blood (excluding erythrocytes, since those do not have a nucleus, therefore -- do not have chromosomes). Yet in natural development of the organism, a bunch of stem cells, which are of regular (diploid set of chromosomes) type, are evolving to form the ovaries, containing from very beginning all the ova (egg cells) that the female may have in her life. Ovum does only have a haploid¹ chromosomes set, until fertilization.
In their procedure the (full, diploid) genetic content of a "induced pluripotent stem cells" gets placed into an ovary-like culture of cells in order to make it ultimately evolve into an ovum. This evolution involves a "meiosis" type of cellular division, in which the end result are haploid cells, and the genetic load gets thinned out. Therefore, it will need fertilization -- a complementary chromosome set from another source.
What they don't talk about (but should) is telomeres², that normal cells, upon division, loose genetic material and thus -- degrade from reproductive point of view.
I'd be very curious how they even define "safe enough" for this. With most therapies, the risk is mostly to the patient. Here the risk could be passed on to a future person who never consented to the experiment.
This is a good tech to have, with applications both in IVF and in research.
Currently, egg retrieval is a significant part of the IVF process - one that's notoriously taxing on the women. Once this gets refined enough for clinical uses, it can become as simple as "take a blood sample once, produce as many eggs as you need". With an added benefit of being able to get eggs when traditional retrieval fails.
19 comments
[ 3.4 ms ] story [ 38.1 ms ] threadShinya Yamanaka created iPSPs in 2009:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinya_Yamanaka
Guess the japanese excel at micromanaging. Although one could say that the research here in the article is more epic than Shinya's discovery, but I remember having watched one of his presentation and it convinced me of pure epicness, if you understand how his team found the "Yamanaka factors". That was by human (work) consistency. About as epic as Christiane Nüsslein-Volhard and her mutant screens, that also involved tons of micro-experiments.
Can we stop adding unnecessary JS to website to stop global warming by calculating AND ALTERING SCROLL?
The reason is that genetics/evolution don't yet seem to fully explain how humans exist. A computer genetic algorithm run for a billion generations doesn't lead to anything anywhere near the the complexity of a human.
I suspect there are as-yet undiscovered effects which shape the next generation. Whether that be DNA methylation, gut bacteria passing from mother to child, selection of the 'correct' egg or sperm out of millions, or something new and un-discovered etc.
And if those effects are bypassed with artificial conception, we might end up with humans which aren't as strong, aren't as smart, aren't as well adapted to a changing environment, etc.
The effect will be small for each generation, but after 5-10 generations of a combination of artificial and natural conception you could end up with meaningful loss of fitness - or perhaps a lack of gain of fitness that would have otherwise occurred.
In routine IVF, parents select for the strongest embryo to implant. This cannot happen in the case of traditional embryo development, where the released egg meets the sperm.
The assumption that IVF could produce weaker humans is an assumption rooted in what? Sci fi?
In their procedure the (full, diploid) genetic content of a "induced pluripotent stem cells" gets placed into an ovary-like culture of cells in order to make it ultimately evolve into an ovum. This evolution involves a "meiosis" type of cellular division, in which the end result are haploid cells, and the genetic load gets thinned out. Therefore, it will need fertilization -- a complementary chromosome set from another source.
What they don't talk about (but should) is telomeres², that normal cells, upon division, loose genetic material and thus -- degrade from reproductive point of view.
¹ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ploidy
² https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telomere
(Hmm, I wonder if this can be done for chicken eggs)
Currently, egg retrieval is a significant part of the IVF process - one that's notoriously taxing on the women. Once this gets refined enough for clinical uses, it can become as simple as "take a blood sample once, produce as many eggs as you need". With an added benefit of being able to get eggs when traditional retrieval fails.
We are DOOMED.