Ask HN: Open source app idea. Get rid of my gun app
This is in response to the horrible story from Connecticut. I live in Massachusetts with a little child. I was concerned and thought of creating a website/app in AWS that would basically let people give away a gun for guaranteed destruction.
Let's say it would be a webapp, developed on github and deployed to AWS with money raised from say Kickstarter. The web site would give away tweetable/facebook badges and would profile people who give away their guns in support/memory of victims.
The features of the web could be developed through an open source community. We may be able to enlist help from sympathetic celebrities.
Please respond with what you know about the below.
1. Will you be interested in a weekend hacking session on a Python or Java app. We could launch a Google Hangout and put a website/raise money over kickstarter. 2. How can somebody in US get rid of a gun legally. I'm talking "assault weapons". There should be a guarantee that this will be destructed and not resold anywhere(Except may be resold to US army or so for a charge that would go into say gun control legislation lobby).
41 comments
[ 2.9 ms ] story [ 85.3 ms ] threadThe term 'assault weapon' is very similar to the actual class of weapons known as 'assault rifles.' I think that the media was attempting to create a term that would define weapons that seem militarized, yet aren't rifles.
So what's an assault rifle? Traditionally, it has been a term used to classify weapons that fire a rifle round (like a 7.62 or a 5.56) instead of a pistol round (such as a 9mm or a .357.) The distinction is notable, because rifle rounds are generally far more powerful. Another traditionally distinguishing characteristic is that assault rifles are normally capable of fully automatic or burst fire (more than one round per trigger pull.) In recent years, assault rifles have begun to include certain semi-automatics, like the AR-15.
The second category of weapon is the submachinegun. While they often look and act similar to an assault rifle, they fire pistol rounds and therefore cannot be considered assault rifles. To my knowledge, semi-automatics that fire pistol rounds are not considered to be submachineguns, even when they look identical to their fully automatic counterparts.
Finally, we have handguns, which many people seem to hate. If you don't know what a hand gun is, then you probably aren't smart enough to have read this far, so that's all I have to say about those.
So why is it important to understand the differences? Well if you want to selectively ban firearms, you'll have a better chance of getting people to listen when you are well educated on the subject. In the same way it pisses programmers off when politicians try to regulate the Internet without understanding the slightest thing about computers, it pisses gun owners off when uninformed people try to implement broad, sweeping, policies that result in the banning of guns based on exaggerated or outright fabricated claims of a particular model's capabilities.
In the 90s, a weapon called the Tec-9 became popular in movies. On screen, the gun was always shown to be fully automatic, even though the real one was almost always semi-automatic. There were a few people who managed to modify them to fire on full-auto, but your average gang member probably struggled just to load it. While movies portrayed tec-9 as the ultimate weapon for badasses (because it actually looked pretty cool), the truth is that the gun's popularity was largely due to the fact that it was a total piece of shit, and therefore could be purchased for about 100-150 dollars, which was ridiculously cheap for a 9mm.
Another oft maligned weapon is the AK-47. Unlike most of the world's AKs, the ones that are available in the U.S. are semi-automatic only. Unfortunately, fear sells, causing the media to imply that thousands of people are running around with machine guns. So why do people buy AK-47s if they are semi-automatic? Well, they are reliable, cheap (unless you get an actual Russian made ak, which can cost thousands) and the ammo is inexpensive. They also look just like a normal ak, and some people want a weapon that looks badass, even if it isn't.
Like the AK, the AR-15 is often mistaken for its military counterpart, but the AR-15 is not an M16. The m16/m4 series of weapons can fire full auto or in three round bursts, depending on the model/revision. The AR-15 on the other hand, fires semi-auto only.
While these weapons are often mistaken for automatics, there are some other criticisms that are often mentioned. When the original assault weapon ban was implemented, high capacity magazines and bayonet lugs were two of the defining attributes of an 'assault weapon.' First of all, bayonets are less effective than bullets, and the use of bayonets is so situational that many soldiers aren't issued bayonets anymore (many still do get them, but they are rarely use...
I mentioned the AR-15 already, because it is a popular weapon for these things. It was used in the movie theater shooting and at the Oregon mall shooting, and probably in others. That being said, there are hundreds of rifles with similar capabilities, so singling out such a weapon would do absolutely nothing to curb the death count in those situations.
Also, it's worth noting that it is impossible to "spray" bullets with a semiautomatic weapon. You can achieve an accurate rate of fire that would surprise most people, but it will still be just a small fraction of what a fully-automatic weapon is capable of putting out. Many times, people who have been traumatized in such a situation will remember things more intensely than they actually occurred, because they are still in shock. It's perfectly natural for people to claim they heard automatic fire, because when you are being shot at, it seems like a hell of a lot at the time.
Anyways, check again tonight or tomorrow, and I'll have posted a better response.
The Tec 9 looks like a submachine gun, but as I previously stated, it is not. It was originally designed as a submachine gun, but when the company failed to obtain a military buyer, it released a semiautomatic version to sell to civilians. Magazine capacities ranged from 10-72 rounds, but the ones used in this shooting appeared to be 32s.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kg99.jpg
Hi-Point model 995 – Semiautomatic Carbine
The Hi-point Carbine is often said to be a rifle, but that is inaccurate. It fires pistol rounds, and the model used in this shooting probably fired 9mm to be more exact. It holds up to 11 rounds total.
http://acolumbinesite.com/weap/hrifle.jpg
Illegally modified, Sawed-Off, Savage-Springfield 67H Shotgun
http://acolumbinesite.com/weap/hpumpshotgun.jpg
Illegally modified, Sawed-Off Double-barrel Savage Arms 311 Shotgun
http://acolumbinesite.com/weap/dkshot.jpg
There isn't anything notable about the two models of shotguns that were used. The only thing really sinister about them is that they were illegally modified by shortening the barrel and the stock. The simple act of modifying a shotgun in such a way is enough to get you sent to prison for a couple of decades. (Remember Ruby Ridge? The ATF raided his house and murdered his wife and kid all because he cut the barrel of a shotgun like 1/32 of an inch too short.)
VA Tech Shooting
In this shooting, the killer used a Glock 19, a 9mm, Semi-automatic pistol that is a favorite among police officers. According to Wikipedia, he was using 15 round magazines, but they also make them from 10 rounds to 31 rounds. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Criminologygunglock.jpg The other weapon the shooter used may actually surprise some people. It was a Walther p22. What is notable about this weapon is that the cartridge it fires is extremely weak. It is chambered for the .22 Long Rifle Cartridge. .22 LR is a rifle round, but it is one of the weakest available, and would do less damage than nearly any other pistol round. This weapon had a 10 round Magazine. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Walther_P22_Corrected.jpg
Norway Shooter
I believe this shooter may have had more weapons, but so far I have been able to verify that he had at least a Glock, and a Ruger Mini-14. Before the shooting, he allegedly attempted to obtain both a Rocket-Propelled Grenade, and a fully automatic AK-47, but failed to do so.
Glock – Most glocks are pretty much the same as the one I described above. The only significant difference it could have had would be a more powerful round, such as a 10mm, .40 cal, or a .45. I can’t find what he used, but basically, it was a typical semi-automatic handgun.
Mini-14 – A semi-automatic rifle that most commonly comes chambered for 5.56/.223 rounds. In other words, it normally fires the same rounds that the AR-15 would. It looks more like a traditional rifle, but it is pretty much equal to the AR-15. The shooter in Norway used several of the standard size, 30 round magazines during his killing spree. It’s worth noting that I've never heard this weapon referred to as an assault rifle until the Norway shooter used it as such.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mini14GB.jpg
AR-15 – I mentioned this weapon in my previous posts, so here’s a picture for anyone who doesn’t know what it looks like.
http://blogs.suntimes.com/ebert/assets_c/2012...
And if there was one, how many do you want in your neighborhood?
You should really learn to use the Internet one of these days. I hear it makes you less ignorant about the world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_military_armored_cars
I wish the man in Connecticut stabbed the kids instead of using an assault weapon to blast them away.
There are far more dangerous types of guns than a 9mm pistol.
I'm a gun owner, former Army, and gun rights advocate, but I'm not crazy, and I do recognize the need for change. I just want to discuss it with level head, outside of the gun/anti-gun lobby confines.
You're just arguing semantics here - if you assault somebody with a pistol, then it's an assault weapon.
Saying that there are more dangerous types of guns than a 9mm pistol is like saying that getting hit by a lorry is worse than getting hit by a car: it doesn't fucking matter, it's still going to kill you.
This is precisely why we do everything in our power to stop countries like Iran getting nukes. It's only a matter of time before some nutjob actually goes and uses one - so the sensible thing to do is make it really, really difficult to get one in the first place.
A few points from this video:
1: Horrible presentation: this is fear-mongering at its finest.
2: Not a single argument presented from the anti-gun perspective.
3: Admissions that length of sentences are not high enough (nothing to do with guns at all).
4: Admissions that police are hilariously under-equipped to respond and deal with crime (nothing to do with guns).
If your police force cannot do its job, and your justice system is a joke, then surely you can see how that would reduce the risks for would-be criminals and make it more likely for them to commit a crime? Why is 'no guns' the only explanation for an increased crime rate (if indeed those figures are valid)?
You can't just say that gun control = tyrannical regime (note: I have never once actually advocated an outright gun ban). Stop being ridiculous.
What level of weaponry do you believe individuals should be allowed to own? Would you be happy for Joe Schmoe to own that same level of weaponry?
Gun advocates are fond of saying 'guns don't kill people, people kill people'.
Yes, people kill people. Using guns. A gun is such a devastating weapon to the human body - the only reason to point it at somebody is if you want them to die. If it's trivially easy to get hold of a gun, then more people are likely to use them against other humans. This isn't complicated.
The pro-gun lobby seems to think that anybody who advocates gun-control is some kind of idiot: that we don't understand how not owning a deadly weapon reduces the ability to defend myself. Of course we understand that - but we believe that the risks of easy access to guns far outweigh the benefits. I am fully aware that criminals will still get hold of guns - but they have access to them anyway if guns are legal. I'd rather have the odd armed criminal than all of them armed.
There is a clear pattern in history for tyrannical regimes. Every enlightened society in history thought the same as you do now, there is absolutely no difference except that today, citizens can trackback and view what happened in the past and maybe fight for there freedoms and prepare themselves. Gun control is the most frightening thing for me and for millions of Americans because we know that martial law will come soon after.
The only thing i can think of that would maybe make you look at it from a different angle is asking let's say, your grandparents (if they are alive) their thoughts about it. If you do that i bet you'd be very surprised by their input.
Take a hard look at history, namely Prohibition. What happens when you restrict access to a resource in demand? People find new, illegal, and potentially more dangerous ways to sell it.
Let's disperse with the idealism that regulating/destroying guns will somehow create world peace. It will create new opportunities for criminal-entrepreneurs. Black markets. Increased crime. More guns in the hands of criminals, and less in the hands of honest people (I don't particularly care about how many "honest" people have guns, but I do care about the consequences of over-regulation).
Nobody is saying that gun control will mean that nobody will ever get shot and killed again, but the harder you make it for people to act on their murderous feelings, the less likely they are to do so.
It is objectively more difficult and time-consuming to build a bomb than it is to point a gun and somebody and shoot them.
Lots of people have feelings of rage at some point in their lives. Most people don't act on those feelings in a destructive way.
Even though most of these school shootings in the US don't seem to be random - there usually turns out to be at least some form of pre-meditation as far as I can tell - the fact that it is so easy to act on your feelings of rage / destruction cannot do anything but lead people who have those feelings down that path.
California, a state with one of the most strict gun laws had the most gun murders in 2010. 69 percent of all murders that year, according to FBI data.
Anybody who wants to kill somebody badly enough will do it with or without gun control: you'll still be able to get hold of a gun regardless. What gun control will do, however, is make it much more unlikely that somebody will go out and act on their murderous feelings.
To the man with a hammer, everything looks like a nail. To a man with a gun, it looks like a valid solution to far more problems than it actually is.
A gun is an effective way to kill somebody - regardless of what happens after the fact. Most of the time in these kinds of massacres, the perpetrator doesn't care at all what happens after the fact - and I'm willing to bet that in a lot of gun murder cases, the perpetrator was not thinking about the consequences / ramifications at the time they pulled the trigger.
There are millions of guns that are already in circulation. Anyone who wants to flout the new law will have plenty of warning and opportunity to start stockpiling them.
Gun control might work, if guns had just been invented and were only in the hands of a few governments and manufacturers. Or if we were some European/Asian country that's had a tight grip on weapons for a long time.
2. The three ways to legally destroy a gun are: 1) destruction by the owner (google instructions), 2) giving the gun to someone who can legally possess it who will destroy it, 3) turn it in at a police station to be destroyed, although the guarantee depends here as some departments resell and won't necessarily tell you. You will need a federal license from the ATF to broker guns which is what your service will be doing despite your goals. You will probably need one organization per state since you can't easily trade guns across state lines. The military will absolutely not buy from you, even if you go to all the trouble to become a federal vendor.
Because of these difficulties, I suggest you stick to a simple pledge plus social media share system, provide destruction instructions and suggest gun-regulation lobbies to interested donors.