When I used my urban sprall metaphor for the programming environment, I was saying it seems like vast amounts of simple stuff -- not deep, but overwhelming and disheartening -- an unimaginable body of things to learn. Making tall buildings was not really relevant to my metaphor.
Just take visual studio. Look at how complex this has gotten. We, now, have source control checkin-check-out, bug tracker stuff, bunch more wizz-bang shit like this?
Software package install stuff -- necessary, I suppose. In my OS I opt for something more transparent. I fight hard not to obscure things. Install/Uninstall? How about putting Apps in a directory and removing them? Do everything you can -- fight -- so it stays as intuitive as deleting a fucken directory, to uninstall! Now, we gotta go to websites to redownload if you put an App on our computers. In the old days, you could copy the files in the directory onto a back-up and put them in place on a new machine.
This is fucked-up. You cannot copy an application directory to back-up media and copy it to restore it. You cannot delete an application by deleting the directory. Nobody would dare to do it this way, these days.
This is like fighting to get a grade in school. You get an A if you manage to keep your head above water and not sink into managed-code shit. Once you lose that fight, everything is shit.
If you ask me what sprall I am talking about, I don't know -- I haven't explored Studio 2010 to see, but let me make my point -- You've been piling-on new features ever since 1999 VC6? Ten years of 20 programmers churning-out new shit?
The printing-presses have been spewing-out new features into visial studio for ten years. That's what I'm talking about -- urban sprall. This is not the way to do things. The IBM PC will die from bloat, a new machine will spring-up and the cycle is likely to continue until someone sees the light.
You can easily render a guilty verdict by asking, "Linus... how many programmers you got? 1000? What have they been doing for the last ten years? game-over, it's a cess-pool!" I mean urban sprall, Los Angeles, or whatever.
God says...
C:\Text\QUIX.TXT
amazed at his simplicity and at seeing what a hold the
absurdities of his master had taken of his fancy, for he had evidently
persuaded himself that he was going to be an emperor.
By this time Dorothea had seated herself upon the curate's mule, and the
barber had fitted the ox-tail beard to his face, and they now told Sancho
to conduct them to where Don Quixote was, warning him not to say that he
knew either the licentiate or the barber, as his master's becoming an
emperor entirely depended on hi
Yes, of course that's enough, if the team/market/idea/timing is right.
The praise was just so effusive it sounded like many of the aspects that make being a founder attractive – autonomy, creativity, and impact – were still being well-provided at Google. I'll be interested to see the startup he builds, when it de-cloaks.
Agreed. Something seems off about this post. Having worked at Google and also having founded multiple startups, I understand the allure of startups. However, I have to say that in my experience, no one leaves a job that they are perfectly happy with in order to found a startup.
The decision to found a startup comes from a deep dissatisfaction with the status quo. Either because there is a problem you are so passionate about solving that you are willing to drop everything, or because you are dissatisfied with your existing work environment, and want to try to create your own.
totally agree dlevine - in my case, life events happened that make me rethink my risk tolerance and ability to go for my dreams (read my prior post for more context)
Satisfaction is not black-and-white. I think it is perfectly valid that someone is satisfied with the existing work environment (hey, there is just so much you can expect from an employer), yet, they want to create their own. It might be that they just want to show the world that they are capable of creating the same (or better) on their own.
New opportunities come in the multitudes. The Valley is also very small. There is always a new company starting where the CTO is a former co-worker of your roommate's cousin or something like that and needs a guy/gal he can trust. Six degrees of Kevin Bacon, NorCal style.
Not really. You learn most of what you're going to learn on a job in the first two years. There was some research into this specifically done for software engineers, but for the life of me I can't recall where I saw this research. The amount you learn declines rapidly after 2 years and bottoms out around 4 years. IMHO, most companies should be actively looking to place very autodidactic employees in a novel role every two years or so to keep them stimulated.
What's fascinating for a company like Google in SV is no matter how good things are, you have to constantly fight to keep folks like John from trying their hand at early stage life. Overall I think it's great for the ecosystem. This type of non-traditional churn (where employers not only have to be the best of the "Big Co.s" but better than doing something completely on your) own pushes everyone to create environments that are not only innovative and rewarding but also fulfilling.
Being a founder and now at Google (John and I started almost the same time and I know him well), I think what's notable about this post is when people usually write "Why I left Google" they are sometimes backhanded compliments or thinly veiled complaints.
What John is saying "I had a great time and learned a lot but I still think starting a company is more interesting".
You mentioned "internal programs", I just assumed.
By the way, I worked at Google for 5+ years, then quit to do a startup. It's hard, but you're in good company. Word of advice: come up with a clever/funny answer ahead of time, because you're going to get a lot of "Wait, why would you quit Google?!?"
Worked with John briefly when he was with analytics. Great energy and I wish him the best (bummed he is leaving, though)! He's dead on about how much Google invests in their employees. The value of the things I have learned and am still continuing to learn here have been nearly unmatched. The best reason to join Google is that there's always something to learn, and some of the best mentors in the world to help you learn those things.
Less than 2 years is not enough time to really soak up the skills, experience, connections, and solving enough difficult problems for it to be maximum value.
I guess I now kinda get why he's doing it, but he's taking a huge risk with only 2 year of working experience total under his belt. Wish him the best!
I disagree. I think working at a large company for long periods of time can actually stifle your ability to be a great founder. You learn bad habits and your intuition can be deformed by things which help you become successful at Big Co but are useless in early stage companies.
Also, I'm at Google and I know John and his work really well. It's almost laughable to imply it was involuntary. John is an all star. The guy actually wants to do a startup because he find the challenge interesting.
24 comments
[ 3.5 ms ] story [ 71.8 ms ] threadJust take visual studio. Look at how complex this has gotten. We, now, have source control checkin-check-out, bug tracker stuff, bunch more wizz-bang shit like this?
Software package install stuff -- necessary, I suppose. In my OS I opt for something more transparent. I fight hard not to obscure things. Install/Uninstall? How about putting Apps in a directory and removing them? Do everything you can -- fight -- so it stays as intuitive as deleting a fucken directory, to uninstall! Now, we gotta go to websites to redownload if you put an App on our computers. In the old days, you could copy the files in the directory onto a back-up and put them in place on a new machine.
This is fucked-up. You cannot copy an application directory to back-up media and copy it to restore it. You cannot delete an application by deleting the directory. Nobody would dare to do it this way, these days.
This is like fighting to get a grade in school. You get an A if you manage to keep your head above water and not sink into managed-code shit. Once you lose that fight, everything is shit.
If you ask me what sprall I am talking about, I don't know -- I haven't explored Studio 2010 to see, but let me make my point -- You've been piling-on new features ever since 1999 VC6? Ten years of 20 programmers churning-out new shit?
The printing-presses have been spewing-out new features into visial studio for ten years. That's what I'm talking about -- urban sprall. This is not the way to do things. The IBM PC will die from bloat, a new machine will spring-up and the cycle is likely to continue until someone sees the light.
You can easily render a guilty verdict by asking, "Linus... how many programmers you got? 1000? What have they been doing for the last ten years? game-over, it's a cess-pool!" I mean urban sprall, Los Angeles, or whatever.
God says... C:\Text\QUIX.TXT
amazed at his simplicity and at seeing what a hold the absurdities of his master had taken of his fancy, for he had evidently persuaded himself that he was going to be an emperor.
By this time Dorothea had seated herself upon the curate's mule, and the barber had fitted the ox-tail beard to his face, and they now told Sancho to conduct them to where Don Quixote was, warning him not to say that he knew either the licentiate or the barber, as his master's becoming an emperor entirely depended on hi
The praise was just so effusive it sounded like many of the aspects that make being a founder attractive – autonomy, creativity, and impact – were still being well-provided at Google. I'll be interested to see the startup he builds, when it de-cloaks.
The decision to found a startup comes from a deep dissatisfaction with the status quo. Either because there is a problem you are so passionate about solving that you are willing to drop everything, or because you are dissatisfied with your existing work environment, and want to try to create your own.
John: have a good luck pursuing your dream!
Google does sound like an awesome environment, but, much like the post author, I'd like to try my hand at building a company.
Being a founder and now at Google (John and I started almost the same time and I know him well), I think what's notable about this post is when people usually write "Why I left Google" they are sometimes backhanded compliments or thinly veiled complaints.
What John is saying "I had a great time and learned a lot but I still think starting a company is more interesting".
By the way, I worked at Google for 5+ years, then quit to do a startup. It's hard, but you're in good company. Word of advice: come up with a clever/funny answer ahead of time, because you're going to get a lot of "Wait, why would you quit Google?!?"
Cheers, John
I guess I now kinda get why he's doing it, but he's taking a huge risk with only 2 year of working experience total under his belt. Wish him the best!
Also, I'm at Google and I know John and his work really well. It's almost laughable to imply it was involuntary. John is an all star. The guy actually wants to do a startup because he find the challenge interesting.