Ask HN: Those with intense focus, how do you do it?

My personal read on this is that, if you have difficulty focusing, you're not really interested in what you're doing.

I say this because everyone I have met in my life -- including myself -- who had excellent focus, also had a transcendent passion for what he was focused on.

Based on your description, you simply aren't interested in your studies or your work, and that is the real problem, not focus per se. Maybe you're having second thoughts about your life's direction or your school major.

> It takes so much work to get into something.

This isn't the voice of someone who is passionate about what he's doing. I think that's the problem. You're asking for advice about how to deal with your life as it is, but my advice is to consider making changes to your life, to your work, to your studies, in a direction consistent with your real interests.

Do something fun, even if it has no immediate value. Motivation runs on momentum. Do whatever seems like the most fun.

http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~kilcup/262/feynman.html

I too often have difficulty focussing on a task, often getting bogged down in reading email or 'quickly' checking the news.

To get around this I use the pomodoro technique [1] and [2]

I have also found quite a bit of success using paper lists; If I write down everything productive I need to get done (mostly on a high-level like 'look into bug nnnn') and only allow myself to work on the items on the list.

I also actively work on keeping my mind on task; if I find myself wandering off and thinking about something important I will write myself a quick note so that I can remember it later, this helps get it off my mind so I can get back to working.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomodoro_Technique [2] http://www.pomodorotechnique.com/

Odds are good that those with intense focus won't be answering your question because they're too busy being focused ;)

The textbook is probably too much text for you - your brain gets bored and you fall asleep. If you're studying for an exam: Try to summarize what you want to remember in as few words as possible - 1 or 2 words per point. You'll have a page at most for an entire unit/subject (don't worry if no one else gets the page). Study that instead, and I think you'll be less likely to be bored. For each point, very quickly (e.g. less than 2-3 seconds), go through the entire point with your mind, then move on to the next. Repeat points that you feel you can't process as fast, they are what you need to get more familiar with. Once you get to the end, as long as you still got energy, go back to the beginning. Eventually try to recall every point the unit without even the single page of paper.

Do this as soon as possible after you wake up. (e.g. study after breakfast). Get a glass of water or a small sandwich every hour and resume studying.

The idea is to process as much information (rather than text) as you are physically able, so you don't ever get bored, and you can stay focused.

Don't be surprised if you get really tired after 3-4 hours. Yesterday I woke up at 12. Started studying at 1, and finished up by 5pm. I was so tired, I had to go sleep for a couple of hours. Had dinner then went to bed for the night.

Get lots of sleep. After a day where you have intensive studied like this, 10-12 hours of sleep is good. Sleep helps your brain move stuff you studied that day into your long term memory. This way you only have to study something once, so that you'll not have the opportunity to get bored studying the same thing again.

Oh, and I do everything on paper so I never have my computer in front of me when I'm studying like this.

Don't know about you, but works for me!

What is it in your field that really makes you jump up and down with joy and amazement?

I sometimes have similar problems (though by far not as bad) and what works for me is to leave a straightforward problem lying on the desk so it's the first thing I see in the morning. Additionally, there's a (very short) list with achievable things I want to do that day. (A lot less than I could do, more a 'at least this far' list.) When I get bored with one task there's usually another one on the list that's ok. And not all textbooks are equally boring. Oh, and deadlines [1]. I don't always follow this, but when I do, I get some stuff done and it's quite satisfying, even though it's just the 'minimal stuff list'.

When you say intense focus, I rather think of short activities like sword training (wonderful state of mind!) or a few minutes of coding the 'heart' of a short program, not longer periods of work.

</rant>

[1]http://rcrosing.home.xs4all.nl/calhob.html

edit: You might also wanna check Lesswrong, they have a lot of ideas about these problems: http://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Akrasia

If you want to fix the cause, I would suggest finding a good quality meditation teacher and learn meditation. Your mind is obviously scattered, you have to learn, and I mean learn how to focus. I've been practicing meditation and similar arts for over 6 years, can't really recommend it highly enough.

I will tell you upfront: it's hard word, but it pays off tremendously.

John Cleese's lecture on creativity [1] was really helpful for me and is something I'm using to get into the flow state myself. The 5 factors Cleese says you need to get creative is nicely summed up in Brainpicking's blog post [2].

Highly recommended!

[1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9rtmxJrKwc [1] http://www.brainpickings.org/index.php/2012/04/12/john-clees...

It's personal. You have found what works for you: "I can focus non-stop for 10-12 hours", and if "Even those 10 hour sessions require an hour or two to get started." then force yourself to spend those 1-2 hours to get started.

A key trick I use is to have doable tasks. Getting started is the hard bit, so start small. Then, acknowledge that you made progress instead of putting it down. Why? Because putting it down will destroy your motivation, your interest and your focus. it's also a distraction (you're thinking about how you don't have focus, instead of what you're supposed to be focussed on).

  If you want to hit a bird on the wing, you must have all your will in focus, you
  must not be thinking about yourself, and equally, you must not be thinking about
  your neighbor: you must be living in your eye on that bird. Every achievement is a
  bird on the wing.

note: "you must not be thinking about yourself"

As a teenager I was always a bit of a cynic about anything that wasn't an exact science, the ideas of introspection of my own mind for things I dismissed as hippy bullshit of the organic food variety.

However later I found that meditation helps my mind and even my asthma a lot. Taking the time for 5-15 minutes every day to just focus on my breathing in the lotus position really does make a difference to my productivity that day.

Also getting and staying of HN / Reddit / SO for a day helps too...

It sounds like your brain enjoys lengthy productive learning sessions and is bored at the idea of jumping between topics at 30minute intervals - "hey brain, just absorb this for me, oh and this, this too" Your brain just shrugs and says "where's the fun in that?"

Make something, create something, build something. Instead of being passive (reading a screen or a book) put your whole brain to task on a project that needs solving, designing and leaves you with an end product.

For me, it took a long time to realise that I absorb information SO fast when I'm immersed in it.

I've written in the past about all the creative strategies I used to get through my exams - whatever you enjoy doing, try to incorporate it alongside the topic you're learning.

People think they tax their brain too much with study but the fact that your brain wanders off into it's own thoughts or sends you to sleep show you it's actually looking for something more challenging to solve. Engage your brain with a more challenging & creative problem.

In my case, the thing was not about eliminating distractions, but about providing a stimulating enough challenges.

Eliminate distractions all you want - if the task is boring, and the environment not stimulating, you'll sooner become crazy than focus.

I also used to stress a lot about not being able to focus. And stress alone hindered my ability even further. Which caused me to stress even more, and so on. The revelation came, when my coach asked me "so, does stressing about work help you?" I decided to take it light - if I cannot work, so be it. Lo and behold, a couple days after letting go, I went into an uberdrive, and built a product which I struggled with for months..

Right now, my recipe is: - if the work doesn't flow, I let it go. I go for a walk, I do sports, wait for a muse. And have faith that it will come - I try to keep my environment stimulating - I had to go a couple friendships, and stop doing activities which no longer helped me develop myself - I try to have a couple kinds of activities lined up - so when I cannot focus on programming, I do marketing, or accounting in my startup. - A good diet helps a lot as well.

But everybody is different. It's important to discover what works and what doesn't - in your case removing distractions clearly doesn't work. Perhaps you could try changing your learning habits (e.g. use Inkling, or Coursera instad of traditional books, or try group learning?), or try finding a different subject, or a different approach to the subject?

Dexamphetamine

If it helps at all, I "suffer" from the exact same thing. I once studied procrastination while I was procrastinating at work and here are my 3 tricks that work, at least half the time:

1. Just don't do what you have to do. Just sit there. BUT the catch is you are not allowed to do ANYTHING else. After about 15 minutes of doing nothing, your interest creeps back for your the task you are working on.

2. Make a big 3 list. At the very beginning of the day, write down the 3 most important things to get done that day. Only work on those things.

3. Cut up the elephant. This is the biggest thing helps me. Many times the items on our todo lists are really gargantuan tasks! Your brain unconsciously knows this and will try to avoid these loaded tasks. Break them down into bite sized elephant chunks. Elephant wasn't eaten in a day ; ) You'll feel better as you knock through those smaller todos. I also recommend Tudumo (www.tudumo.com) as a todo tracker. It has a lot of keyboard shortcuts. I have a list called "elephant chunks" and as soon as I tackle an item on the main list, I create the elephant chunks list and start hammering those suckers down.

I still lapse into massive procrastination, but these tricks have helped me a lot. You aren't alone. And I don't think you are lazy. If you are anything like me, this is probably some of the stuff you are most passionate about and it's killing you that you are avoiding it. Make a new big 3 list every day and don't give up!

Are you unable to focus at all times even when you do something you completely enjoy? Or are you unable to focus only on boring tasks? That's two different problems and solutions.

I have found that when I have such problems, I'm usually missing one of three things:

Sometimes I need a clearer idea of what needs to be done. Is it vague? Make it more specific so you know where to get started. Is it open-ended? Give it an end-point so you know how far you are from being finished. Am I even thinking of the very next step I need to take?

Sometimes I need a clearer idea of why I'm doing it. It's very easy to dissociate tasks from the original motivations, and it starts feeling like just "stuff you gotta do". So I take a minute and either re-associate the task in front of me with some larger or longer-term goal that is presently appealing (i.e. it doesn't have to be about "passion"), or I come up with a completely ad-hoc motive like turning it into a game or giving it some kind of constraint that makes it a little more challenging. Sometimes I find that the thing I'm trying to do is actually something I don't care about the original purpose of anymore, which quite suddenly makes it easy to stop and move on to something else.

Sometimes I find that I'm missing a sense of confidence that it's what I should be doing right now. It may be that I'm trying to work on a very unimportant thing and should switch to one of the things I keep being distracted by, but I have to consciously compare them before I can realize that that's why I'm getting distracted. Other times, I realize that the things that are bubbling up in my mind can wait, and the act of actually thinking about them and realizing that puts them to rest. I don't try to force myself into working on "the most important thing" at all times.

I try to work out these questions only when I happen to notice that I'm not really "doing" the thing that I'm supposedly doing, whether it's work or fun or even sleep. I don't try to pre-emptively make sure I have these things, either. -- I think of it as a way to answer the brain's objections to what you're doing rather than a way to force it to do what you want.

Disclaimer: I am not a very good entrepreneur.

Been struggling with this also for my whole life. Solutions that work _for me_:

1. Before doing anything, figure out: Is this what I am flowing to do now? Or is it something else ? If I feel like I have to force myself to do something, usually I am doing it against the flow. This is why I hate dayjobs.

2. Go for a swim/run/do yoga/meditate. All of these help me to focus better, when my body is relaxed, so is the mind. Create a routine for yourself, when I relax my body right in the morning, it is usually a good day and I get things done. If I skip any of these, it is harder to sit down and stay in one place.

3. If something feels impossible, do something else. Dance, go out for a walk, practice close combat weapons, something physical.

4. Break the problem into small pieces, write those pieces down. Complete one at a time. Preferably so that each piece has different kinds of things to do, like program, then design, then do some writing. So that it keeps interesting and not just repeating the same thing all day.

Also, when I truly have to force myself to complete something, I have found one good technique to get me into the zone: put on my headphones, turn on some good trance/psytrance, and just dance into the zone for 5-10 minutes, then continue coding in this state of trance. Helps to get in to the flow.

For the last 8 years, I've training myself like a Pavlovian dog.

All I need to focus is my headphones and the song programmed with the mood I want.

Many songs have come & disappeared in my playlist of "mind silence" but right now, if you play "Intro - XX" in a loop into my ears then I will sit down and work.

All that helps me is to get started.

It helps that I love my work - after I really get started, my train of thought is rarely derailed.

But despite loving it, I do need to be manipulated into putting in the first 40-50 minutes of time - every day.

And music makes me go with the flow.

Can you expand a bit on how it has gotten worse over the years? How were you better at focusing before? How do you know it has gotten worse? I can imagine it may be especially frustrating if it is something that has been worsening over time.

My approach:

1. Low music. Better as background music. Random, any radio.

2. Shut down all Twitter apps.

3. HN procrastinator mode-on.

4. Get on doing the stuff no matter what's going outside.

My tricks from school:

Short term: Colored pens, white paper, make cheat sheets (as if you were planning to bring them with you, but leave them at home).

Slightly longer term: Get hold of real exam assignments (if possible and allowed) as soon as possible. This helps motivation quite significantly because you can see what you would make you fail today. Knowing one assignement that I wouldn't pass does a whole lot to motivation.

Do stuff. I created 3d models (of yet to be invented furniture and tools) out of cardboard (empty pizza boxes where my favourite.)

Attempt at getting good/fast in everything you touch. But let no failure ruin your day.

Long term: Find and reinforce motivation. Why are you reading that textbook in the first place? Because you are going to be good at something. Why? Because you are going to get good work. Why? Because you want to change the world/help someone you know/etc.

Learn to defend yourself against your own and others critisism while not blaming others: There all kinds of things that rise against us: disabilities makes thing harder, economy (hard to study while your brain is working non stop on how to pay x), etc. Tell yourself: If I manage all this, that will be quite a story to tell.

The lack of focus can be directly derived from the lack of interest, vision and love on what you're doing.

When you're thinking about other things, it means what you're about to do is so much of a chore to you that you subconsciously procrastinate and despise doing it. Remember that what you're working on is something you love; you'll soon find out that everything else doesn't matter. Love isn't a feeling, it's a decision to commit because you found value no one else can't seem to see.

It's clear that the most productive people are people in love in what they do. They find joy and value even in their smallest chores/tasks. They don't need to "minimize distractions" or use "software program that blocks any time-wasting internet site", it's natural for them to have a distaste for other things except on what's currently right in-front of them.

The practical task lists or methods on "how to focus" are easy as pie, there's a lot of content tackling, although looking for something you love working on or reminding yourself that you should love what you're doing - that's something only you can answer.

Tricks like reducing distractions and using your time better are interesting and sometimes helpful, but also a great way to procrastinate. When you're an adult, you become more self-aware, which probably explains why it wasn't a problem in the past.

I agree with what others have said - you may simply not be interested in what you're doing. If that's the case, change.

I have three bits of advice:

1. It could be you're not sleeping enough. Sleep more and drink less caffeine and alcohol.

2. If you aim to do a great, great, job of whatever you do, it can become much more rewarding. Be a perfectionist. (nb for some people perfectionism leads to procrastination, but not for most).

3. Get on with it. Don't allow yourself to read any further advice on how to be effective. Get up early, get working, work your ass off, have a fixed schedule with breaks and don't try to do long hours. I think an awful lot of people worry too much about productivity rather than just getting on and doing the work. It's also a case of momentum - once you start getting some feedback on what you've achieved, your hard work will feel justified and you'll be more motivated.

Reduce distractions is a good start.

Close email windows, HN, put your phone on silent, find a space in which noise does not intrude, remove the clock.

Lock out any external signal that might distract you. It might be noise, it might be discomfort in a mouse you're using.

Then the second part is that you've got to enjoy what you do. The craft, the elegance of it. Take pride in wanting to do it well, refine that. Look for improvements and do it even better. Be excited by the improvements. This is the undefinable quality of Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance.

With those two things; reducing distraction and find the beauty, elegance and satisfaction in the simple and mundane... I found it's possible to totally immerse yourself in whatever task is at hand. Just taking care of distractions isn't enough, you need the pursuit of quality too.