for a detailed analysis of how the Harvard Financial Aid Initiative influenced admissions, written back when there couldn't be any analysis of what happened to the students after they arrived at Harvard. The submitted article from the Boston Globe is an interesting follow-up.
20% of everyone at Harvard comes from a family making less than $60k/year.
...and yet, because some of the other students get driven to campus in fancy cars, you feel left out.
I arrived at my Ivy League college in a station wagon and signed up for a four year commitment to the Air Force in order to help me pay for college...and, yeah, I knew kids who had gone to Phillips Exeter and "summered" places ("summered" ... never knew that was a word before college ... I "summered" at the mall, working retail for $5/hr...).
And you know what?
It wasn't a big deal.
I felt a bit excluded from some groups...just like in high school, and just like after high school.
So many people love to bitch and moan and whine.
You're born into an amazing country, at an amazing point in history, and someone gives you a full scholarship to one of the most amazing universities the world has ever known...and you whine that you feel a bit left out?
Looks like he's not the only guy out there who likes to bitch and moan and whine.
Edit:
Read the article, then decide.
Likeliest scenario: Harvard has a big initiative to make it even more "need blind" (already linked-to in this thread) and seems to legitimately "care" about the educational experiences of those receiving aid under this program ("care" in scare quotes b/c it's hard to precisely define what "care" means when you're talking about an institution of Harvard's size).
Program's been running for a bit, early results starting to trickle in, reporter at Boston Globe decides to see how things are going (perhaps out of legitimate interest, and also b/c in greater Boston stories about Harvard always help move product).
Reporter finds some kid who's part of the program and willing to answer some questions. Kid gets asked questions like:
- do you sometimes feel out of place? can you give me an example?
- have there been times when the aide wasn't sufficient? can you tell me more about that? what'd you do?
- what changes would you make to the program? what else could they do?
...and probably gives honest answers, as reflected in the quotes.
Now, perhaps you could fault him for not expressing more gratitude -- perhaps he would have been more couth had he been sure to follow every mention of "Harvard" with an utterance like ", whose name be praised and whose benevolence towards me I will be forever thankful for,..." -- but we're talking about a kid here, and a kid who almost certainly has no media savvy and seems to have just given honest answers.
Look what I can do to you:
- I arrived at my Ivy League college in a station wagon. I felt a bit excluded from some groups...just like in high school, and just like after high school.
- Yeah, I knew kids who had gone to Phillips Exeter and "summered" places -- [I] never knew that ["summered"] was a word before college. I "summered" at the mall, working retail for $5/hr.
- I signed up for a four year commitment to the Air Force to help me pay for college.
What a whiner, right? Where's the gratitude there?
Hence the mild tweak pre-edit: you're implicitly calling this guy's character out onto the map:
- YOU joined the airforce and felt left out and it wasn't a big deal and you're shocked at the lack of gratitude
- HE is a whiner and moaner etc.
All based on a handful of quotes in an article with an obvious agenda -- and we're not talking quotes from someone who has given any indication of seeking out media attention beyond consenting to do an interview.
It leaves a bad taste in my eyes to see a response like yours to the article I read: who knows why, really, you like to bitch and moan about other people's reactions to their circumstances, but you apparently do, and in so doing reveal something about your own character.
"What a whiner, right? Where's the gratitude there?"
Gratitude for what? Did Harvard cut him a break?
It sounds like he busted his ass and paid his own way.
" ...who knows why, really, you like to bitch and moan about other people's reactions to their circumstances, but you apparently do, and in so doing reveal something about your own character."
The only evidence the guy had that the kid at Harvard is overly-bothered by his classmates' circumstances and insufficiently grateful for the opportunity Harvard has given him is that the article included too many quotes about feeling left out and too few about gratitude.
The point of editing the guys stuff in a journalistic fashion was to point out the flimsiness of that basis for judgment: cut a sentence or two, reorder some independent quotes, and you wind up with a very different impression than the one he was trying to convey; he also had the advantage of just saying what he wanted, instead of responding to leading questions from a journalist.
Which was kind of my point: it sounds like the kid's had a rough time adjusting, but is adapting to his circumstances (got a room change, gets his books from the library, has an on-campus job, etc.) and doesn't seem to be seeking attention; anything you know about the kid is thirdhand (filtered once through the journalist and again through an editor), and if you've ever dealt with the media you'd know exactly how far you ought to trust them for accurate reportage (hint: not very far).
A simple response along the lines of: "eh, well, look at the bright side: he's still getting a free ride at an awesome school at an awesome time in history." wouldn't have set me off the same way: it's pointing out the obvious, and avoiding making character judgments about our man at Harvard.
Instead what we get is:
(1) an opening shot of mockery "BOO HOO"
(2) a reminder that the kid gets a full ride @ harvard (good point) and that 20% of the class makes is from familes earning < 60k; the latter observation isn't much help without a better picture of the kid's specific situation and some more-detailed understanding of the internal structure of the <60k cohort (how many are <20k? <30k? <40k? etc. -- huge differences at each step)
(3) a pretty insulting mischaracterization of what the kid is quoted saying in the story's opening paragraphs. We went from:
(A) He was valedictorian of his senior class, and had been accepted at all 13 colleges to which he applied. But when Miguel Garcia entered Harvard University last fall, he felt he didn't belong.
As classmates moved into Harvard Yard that first day with parents - and in some cases, chauffeurs - driving fancy vehicles packed with boxes, Garcia arrived alone. His belongings fit into two suitcases and a backpack. His mother, a worker at an industrial laundry, and father, a janitor at a Detroit casino, could not afford the trip.
"Everyone else seemed so polished and entitled and seamlessly adapting," Garcia recalled. "It just felt like they'd been here their whole lives. I was really intimidated. I didn't feel like I had anything in common."
...to:
(B) because some of the other students get driven to campus in fancy cars, you feel left out
Making the leap from (A) to (B) makes me worry for tjic's reading comprehension. Here's why: first paragraph has kid claim he doesn't belong. Third paragraph has kid quoted explaining the feeling of not-belonging in more detail -- other students are more polished, seem to him to fit in better, he's intimidated and doesn't feel he fits in.
The stuff about cars? That's in paragraph two. Paragraph two has no quotes, and isn't directly attributed to anyone. It's a poetic flourish from the author, and it's using one of the oldest tricks in the journalists' book: you sneak a paragraph of unattributed, "raw facts" between two quotes, and the unsavvy, uncritical reader will usually mentally assign some relationship between the facts and the quotes.
In this case tjic fell for it: he collapses (A) to (B) "some kids show up in fancy cars and you whine? loser!"
But there's nothing in the article text to make such a judgment airtight: his stuff in the third paragraph is very generic (other ppl seemed to fit in better than I did), making no mention at all of cars (or any other specifics -- who knows what this quote was said in response to).
One thing's definitely weird: of the people I know who've worked through actual adversity (eg: swam their way from north to south korea), very few get their back up about other people's whining; if kids today have it easier, great (that's why you made the swim in the first place; why should things be hard?) and if the whining's justified, it's easy to relate to adversity, b/c you know what it's like.
This is an interesting point in itself. In general, I think people can react to having overcome adversity extremely differently. From the kind of identity & pride you mention (the falsifiers feeling) to extreme shame. My instinct is that the relatively harder cases tend towards the shame.
When I think of someone really busting ass I think of immigrants working 3 jobs
There is one thing that we can be certain of: for every person complaining online, by very virtue of their being a part of the privileged class of people on the planet that has a computer, the world provides an almost infinite number of people who have it harder.
Haven't you heard the news? Since John Rawls got popular, you're allowed to bitch at the injustice of the universe if anyone was born with a slight advantage over you.
I do not espouse parent's theory, but for the devoutly religious there could be no greater chasm to cross. However, interfaith marriages typically require one partner to submit to the other's creed.
14 comments
[ 4.3 ms ] story [ 46.1 ms ] threadhttp://works.bepress.com/c_kirabo_jackson/12/
which leads to
http://digitalcommons.ilr.cornell.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?ar...
for a detailed analysis of how the Harvard Financial Aid Initiative influenced admissions, written back when there couldn't be any analysis of what happened to the students after they arrived at Harvard. The submitted article from the Boston Globe is an interesting follow-up.
You get a full ride to Harvard.
20% of everyone at Harvard comes from a family making less than $60k/year.
...and yet, because some of the other students get driven to campus in fancy cars, you feel left out.
I arrived at my Ivy League college in a station wagon and signed up for a four year commitment to the Air Force in order to help me pay for college...and, yeah, I knew kids who had gone to Phillips Exeter and "summered" places ("summered" ... never knew that was a word before college ... I "summered" at the mall, working retail for $5/hr...).
And you know what?
It wasn't a big deal.
I felt a bit excluded from some groups...just like in high school, and just like after high school.
So many people love to bitch and moan and whine.
You're born into an amazing country, at an amazing point in history, and someone gives you a full scholarship to one of the most amazing universities the world has ever known...and you whine that you feel a bit left out?
Cry me a !@#%@#-ing river.
Edit:
Read the article, then decide.
Likeliest scenario: Harvard has a big initiative to make it even more "need blind" (already linked-to in this thread) and seems to legitimately "care" about the educational experiences of those receiving aid under this program ("care" in scare quotes b/c it's hard to precisely define what "care" means when you're talking about an institution of Harvard's size).
Program's been running for a bit, early results starting to trickle in, reporter at Boston Globe decides to see how things are going (perhaps out of legitimate interest, and also b/c in greater Boston stories about Harvard always help move product).
Reporter finds some kid who's part of the program and willing to answer some questions. Kid gets asked questions like:
- do you sometimes feel out of place? can you give me an example?
- have there been times when the aide wasn't sufficient? can you tell me more about that? what'd you do?
- what changes would you make to the program? what else could they do?
...and probably gives honest answers, as reflected in the quotes.
Now, perhaps you could fault him for not expressing more gratitude -- perhaps he would have been more couth had he been sure to follow every mention of "Harvard" with an utterance like ", whose name be praised and whose benevolence towards me I will be forever thankful for,..." -- but we're talking about a kid here, and a kid who almost certainly has no media savvy and seems to have just given honest answers.
Look what I can do to you:
- I arrived at my Ivy League college in a station wagon. I felt a bit excluded from some groups...just like in high school, and just like after high school.
- Yeah, I knew kids who had gone to Phillips Exeter and "summered" places -- [I] never knew that ["summered"] was a word before college. I "summered" at the mall, working retail for $5/hr.
- I signed up for a four year commitment to the Air Force to help me pay for college.
What a whiner, right? Where's the gratitude there?
Hence the mild tweak pre-edit: you're implicitly calling this guy's character out onto the map:
- YOU joined the airforce and felt left out and it wasn't a big deal and you're shocked at the lack of gratitude
- HE is a whiner and moaner etc.
All based on a handful of quotes in an article with an obvious agenda -- and we're not talking quotes from someone who has given any indication of seeking out media attention beyond consenting to do an interview.
It leaves a bad taste in my eyes to see a response like yours to the article I read: who knows why, really, you like to bitch and moan about other people's reactions to their circumstances, but you apparently do, and in so doing reveal something about your own character.
Gratitude for what? Did Harvard cut him a break?
It sounds like he busted his ass and paid his own way.
" ...who knows why, really, you like to bitch and moan about other people's reactions to their circumstances, but you apparently do, and in so doing reveal something about your own character."
Pot? Kettle?
The point of editing the guys stuff in a journalistic fashion was to point out the flimsiness of that basis for judgment: cut a sentence or two, reorder some independent quotes, and you wind up with a very different impression than the one he was trying to convey; he also had the advantage of just saying what he wanted, instead of responding to leading questions from a journalist.
Which was kind of my point: it sounds like the kid's had a rough time adjusting, but is adapting to his circumstances (got a room change, gets his books from the library, has an on-campus job, etc.) and doesn't seem to be seeking attention; anything you know about the kid is thirdhand (filtered once through the journalist and again through an editor), and if you've ever dealt with the media you'd know exactly how far you ought to trust them for accurate reportage (hint: not very far).
A simple response along the lines of: "eh, well, look at the bright side: he's still getting a free ride at an awesome school at an awesome time in history." wouldn't have set me off the same way: it's pointing out the obvious, and avoiding making character judgments about our man at Harvard.
Instead what we get is:
(1) an opening shot of mockery "BOO HOO"
(2) a reminder that the kid gets a full ride @ harvard (good point) and that 20% of the class makes is from familes earning < 60k; the latter observation isn't much help without a better picture of the kid's specific situation and some more-detailed understanding of the internal structure of the <60k cohort (how many are <20k? <30k? <40k? etc. -- huge differences at each step)
(3) a pretty insulting mischaracterization of what the kid is quoted saying in the story's opening paragraphs. We went from:
(A) He was valedictorian of his senior class, and had been accepted at all 13 colleges to which he applied. But when Miguel Garcia entered Harvard University last fall, he felt he didn't belong.
As classmates moved into Harvard Yard that first day with parents - and in some cases, chauffeurs - driving fancy vehicles packed with boxes, Garcia arrived alone. His belongings fit into two suitcases and a backpack. His mother, a worker at an industrial laundry, and father, a janitor at a Detroit casino, could not afford the trip.
"Everyone else seemed so polished and entitled and seamlessly adapting," Garcia recalled. "It just felt like they'd been here their whole lives. I was really intimidated. I didn't feel like I had anything in common."
...to:
(B) because some of the other students get driven to campus in fancy cars, you feel left out
Making the leap from (A) to (B) makes me worry for tjic's reading comprehension. Here's why: first paragraph has kid claim he doesn't belong. Third paragraph has kid quoted explaining the feeling of not-belonging in more detail -- other students are more polished, seem to him to fit in better, he's intimidated and doesn't feel he fits in.
The stuff about cars? That's in paragraph two. Paragraph two has no quotes, and isn't directly attributed to anyone. It's a poetic flourish from the author, and it's using one of the oldest tricks in the journalists' book: you sneak a paragraph of unattributed, "raw facts" between two quotes, and the unsavvy, uncritical reader will usually mentally assign some relationship between the facts and the quotes.
In this case tjic fell for it: he collapses (A) to (B) "some kids show up in fancy cars and you whine? loser!"
But there's nothing in the article text to make such a judgment airtight: his stuff in the third paragraph is very generic (other ppl seemed to fit in better than I did), making no mention at all of cars (or any other specifics -- who knows what this quote was said in response to).
(4) some rambles that're supp...
This is an interesting point in itself. In general, I think people can react to having overcome adversity extremely differently. From the kind of identity & pride you mention (the falsifiers feeling) to extreme shame. My instinct is that the relatively harder cases tend towards the shame.
*BTW, Well said.
There is one thing that we can be certain of: for every person complaining online, by very virtue of their being a part of the privileged class of people on the planet that has a computer, the world provides an almost infinite number of people who have it harder.