The trailer looks like an OWS supporter took every 1 percenter and anti-immigration trope in the book, added a bunch of explosions and called it a "film".
I really hope the actual movie is more nuanced in the politics it looks like it's trying to shove down our throats.
Your comment makes it quite clear you haven't actually _read_ the article.
> The director finds it unfortunate that observers are already drawing parallels between Elysium and the Occupy movement, a phenomenon that he says wasn’t even a consideration. Blomkamp identifies as neither liberal nor conservative, which doesn’t stop people from ascribing all sorts of agendas to him and his films.
and
> But Blomkamp insists Elysium isn’t some sort of filmic Paul Krugman op-ed piece. It’s important for him that his movies grapple with things that matter, in this case economic disparity, immigration, health care, corporate greed. But he disdains prescription-happy “message” movies—that’s what documentaries are for, he says—and intends Elysium to be first and foremost a mass-appeal, summer popcorn flick. Allegory, satire, and dark humor interest him; providing pat answers to society’s woes does not. “Anybody who thinks they can change the world by making films,” he says, “is sorely mistaken.”
He actually addresses that in the interview. He says he was not influenced by OWS in any way when making the film.
But Blomkamp insists Elysium isn’t some sort of filmic Paul Krugman op-ed piece. It’s important for him that his movies grapple with things that matter, in this case economic disparity, immigration, health care, corporate greed. But he disdains prescription-happy “message” movies—that’s what documentaries are for, he says—and intends Elysium to be first and foremost a mass-appeal, summer popcorn flick. Allegory, satire, and dark humor interest him; providing pat answers to society’s woes does not. “Anybody who thinks they can change the world by making films,” he says, “is sorely mistaken.
I did read the article. I also watched the movie trailer.
As with politics, I tend to take actions more into consideration than words. The right words are too easy to fabricate. The right actions, not so much.
Keep in mind Blomkamp is South African, and his last major film (District 9) had similar themes. It was also released in 2009, well before OWS came into existence. It's clear that whatever politics Blomkamp holds, it comes from from growing up in apartheid South Africa. His first work featuring the themes of poverty, wealth disparity, and racial inequality predate OWS by at least six years (see: the short Alive in Joburg, which is basically the direct predecessor of District 9).
So while Blomkamp may share some politics with OWS, it's silly to suggest he borrowed them from OWS or the recent politics of the last couple of years.
Side note: the fact that his sci-fi allegories of apartheid-era South Africa has enough in parallel with present-day America to inspire suspicion, is troubling.
What does it matter where the tropes originally came from? They are what they are and they're easy to identify regardless of whether from OWS or his own personal experiences.
Jeez, just commenting on the actual movie trailer itself and the politics that it seems to be pushing pretty hard. Seems like I pushed some buttons to get the straw men and heavy negative moderation hammers thrown at me.
Yes, because class conflict totally started with OWS. Moreover, you don't have to be an OWS-supporter hippie to understand that different groups of people have different incentives and that the interests of different groups of people can come into conflict. One of the greatest fantasies perpetuated on our generation is the idea that there are simple policy prescriptions that are "good for everyone."
Yes, because class conflict totally started with OWS.
I wasn't aware that I had to mention the entire history of class conflict in order to note a strong similarity with a recent movement.
fantasies perpetuated on our generation is the idea that there are simple policy prescriptions that are "good for everyone.
Ironic that you say that since in political threads you generally defend a one-size-fits-all, overpowering American government. If you really believed what you said then I'd think you'd be all for Freedom and individual Liberty. Instead, I view you as an opponent of those things in favor of the State.
Democracy is emphatically not a "one-size-fits-all" system. It a system designed to maximize the prosperity of a majority of the people, often to the detriment of this or the other minority group. I like freedom and individual liberty just fine, but I think the "default rule" should prioritize executing the will of the majority through the popularly-elected government. I think every instance in which a court holds unconstitutional some validly passed law of Congress or some program of the President that enjoys popular support is an instance of the courts telling the majority what it can and cannot do, and I think such events should be the exception, not the rule. The courts should seek to give effect to the will of the democratically-elected branches if it is possible.
There is nothing inconsistent with that view and the recognition that a minority of people who hold a majority of the wealth have incentives that do not necessarily align with the interests of the majority. Indeed, it is entirely consistent with that view, based on the basic belief that the purpose of government is to maximize the prosperity of the majority, with the protection of the rights of individuals being an important but secondary concern.
The future as described in 2312 by Kim Stanley Robinson I think is more likely, perhaps scarier even, and taken to levels beyond Elysium (though don't get me wrong, I'm very excited for Elysium).
2312 is a future where many generations of people have lived on colonies on Mercury, Venus, Mars, hollowed-out asteroids ("terraria"), the outer moons. The spacers live in a new paradigm, not a rich paradise like Elysium, but a very pleasant, long and happy life, while those who inhabit the Earth live in a warring, diseased, overpopulated and climate-change-disaster struck Earth.
I think the crowd here would like this book. You should read it.
I tried getting into it, but found it a little on the slow side. Perhaps it was because I had just read Leviathan Wakes directly before it, which is a lot more fast-paced and similarly covers human colonization of the inner solar system and asteroid belt (aka "Belters")
Reading the Mars Trilogy first is probably a good idea, because it sets the pace: the hard science fiction nature of these books means you get long technical descriptions and character analysis. It's awesome, I think, but you definitely have to get in the right zone.
If current systems and economics stayed the way they are, then I imagine that it has a higher probability of being true. I foresee those economic structures shifting / changing though.
I don't really care for the story line, but finally somebody worked a high-quality render of a full-scale rotating habitat into a movie! Always wanted to see how that might look since Rendezvous with Rama and Hamilton's books.
Way back in 1984 (starting with Neuromancer), William Gibson wrote about an orbiting space station owned by the super-rich.[1]
(WARNING: Spoilers below)
"Tessier-Ashpool is a fictional family appearing in William Gibson's Sprawl trilogy novels. The family owns Freeside, a space station shaped
like a spindle Bernal sphere constructed in high orbit. The family resides in the Villa Straylight, which occupies one end of the spindle.
The family is organized and run as a corporation, Tessier-Ashpool S.A.. Family members are kept under cryogenic stasis and thawed out
periodically so that governance of the family is cycled between members. According to "orbital law" they are legally dead while cryogenically
preserved.
...
The Tessier-Ashpools were founded with the marriage of scions of two powerful families: Marie-France Tessier, who was Swiss and John Harness
Ashpool, an Australian who inherited a Melbourne engineering company. After the two were married, Ashpool began construction of Freeside in
high orbit due to the relatively relaxed laws governing construction.
The family became extremely successful financially, developing the attached space station, sponsoring human colonization of space, and
acquiring a number of other firms which subsequently flourished.
...
However, following the death of Marie-France, the family became extremely reclusive. Family members, including Ashpool, tended to place
themselves in cryogenic sleep. At any one given time, only one or two of the children would be awake. They are also known for cloning their
own assassins, "vat-grown" ninja who follow their orders without question.
...
By the time of Neuromancer the family has become extremely degenerate and dysfunctional. The patriarch Ashpool spends almost all of his time
in cryogenic stasis. A dissolute alcoholic and heavy drug user, when he is awakened for the final time he has sex with and subsequently
murders a clone of his daughter prior to committing suicide."
You can find there rich and poor, genetic modifications only rich can afford, one (lack of the need to sleep) so special that it reshapes world. You can find there universal income as payment for voting. You can find philosophy of exchange through voluntary mutually beneficial contracts promoted by such influential inventor that it raises to the same eminence buddism has. Awesome read.
40 comments
[ 2.7 ms ] story [ 80.1 ms ] threadI really hope the actual movie is more nuanced in the politics it looks like it's trying to shove down our throats.
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, just sit back and enjoy the ride.
> The director finds it unfortunate that observers are already drawing parallels between Elysium and the Occupy movement, a phenomenon that he says wasn’t even a consideration. Blomkamp identifies as neither liberal nor conservative, which doesn’t stop people from ascribing all sorts of agendas to him and his films.
and
> But Blomkamp insists Elysium isn’t some sort of filmic Paul Krugman op-ed piece. It’s important for him that his movies grapple with things that matter, in this case economic disparity, immigration, health care, corporate greed. But he disdains prescription-happy “message” movies—that’s what documentaries are for, he says—and intends Elysium to be first and foremost a mass-appeal, summer popcorn flick. Allegory, satire, and dark humor interest him; providing pat answers to society’s woes does not. “Anybody who thinks they can change the world by making films,” he says, “is sorely mistaken.”
No, it makes it quite clear that I didn't just nod my head and agree with whatever came out of his mouth.
But Blomkamp insists Elysium isn’t some sort of filmic Paul Krugman op-ed piece. It’s important for him that his movies grapple with things that matter, in this case economic disparity, immigration, health care, corporate greed. But he disdains prescription-happy “message” movies—that’s what documentaries are for, he says—and intends Elysium to be first and foremost a mass-appeal, summer popcorn flick. Allegory, satire, and dark humor interest him; providing pat answers to society’s woes does not. “Anybody who thinks they can change the world by making films,” he says, “is sorely mistaken.
Yeah, and I say I'm the King of England.
There's a reason why he was asked the question. It's because at very least the trailer makes it look like he's doing some pretty heavy axe grinding.
As with politics, I tend to take actions more into consideration than words. The right words are too easy to fabricate. The right actions, not so much.
So while Blomkamp may share some politics with OWS, it's silly to suggest he borrowed them from OWS or the recent politics of the last couple of years.
Side note: the fact that his sci-fi allegories of apartheid-era South Africa has enough in parallel with present-day America to inspire suspicion, is troubling.
What does it matter where the tropes originally came from? They are what they are and they're easy to identify regardless of whether from OWS or his own personal experiences.
Jeez, just commenting on the actual movie trailer itself and the politics that it seems to be pushing pretty hard. Seems like I pushed some buttons to get the straw men and heavy negative moderation hammers thrown at me.
I wasn't aware that I had to mention the entire history of class conflict in order to note a strong similarity with a recent movement.
fantasies perpetuated on our generation is the idea that there are simple policy prescriptions that are "good for everyone.
Ironic that you say that since in political threads you generally defend a one-size-fits-all, overpowering American government. If you really believed what you said then I'd think you'd be all for Freedom and individual Liberty. Instead, I view you as an opponent of those things in favor of the State.
There is nothing inconsistent with that view and the recognition that a minority of people who hold a majority of the wealth have incentives that do not necessarily align with the interests of the majority. Indeed, it is entirely consistent with that view, based on the basic belief that the purpose of government is to maximize the prosperity of the majority, with the protection of the rights of individuals being an important but secondary concern.
b) having grown up in South Africa, Blomkamp may have some unique insights about human nature.
it's certainly interesting to contemplate what's going to happen.
2312 is a future where many generations of people have lived on colonies on Mercury, Venus, Mars, hollowed-out asteroids ("terraria"), the outer moons. The spacers live in a new paradigm, not a rich paradise like Elysium, but a very pleasant, long and happy life, while those who inhabit the Earth live in a warring, diseased, overpopulated and climate-change-disaster struck Earth.
I think the crowd here would like this book. You should read it.
(WARNING: Spoilers below)
"Tessier-Ashpool is a fictional family appearing in William Gibson's Sprawl trilogy novels. The family owns Freeside, a space station shaped like a spindle Bernal sphere constructed in high orbit. The family resides in the Villa Straylight, which occupies one end of the spindle.
The family is organized and run as a corporation, Tessier-Ashpool S.A.. Family members are kept under cryogenic stasis and thawed out periodically so that governance of the family is cycled between members. According to "orbital law" they are legally dead while cryogenically preserved.
...
The Tessier-Ashpools were founded with the marriage of scions of two powerful families: Marie-France Tessier, who was Swiss and John Harness Ashpool, an Australian who inherited a Melbourne engineering company. After the two were married, Ashpool began construction of Freeside in high orbit due to the relatively relaxed laws governing construction.
The family became extremely successful financially, developing the attached space station, sponsoring human colonization of space, and acquiring a number of other firms which subsequently flourished.
...
However, following the death of Marie-France, the family became extremely reclusive. Family members, including Ashpool, tended to place themselves in cryogenic sleep. At any one given time, only one or two of the children would be awake. They are also known for cloning their own assassins, "vat-grown" ninja who follow their orders without question.
...
By the time of Neuromancer the family has become extremely degenerate and dysfunctional. The patriarch Ashpool spends almost all of his time in cryogenic stasis. A dissolute alcoholic and heavy drug user, when he is awakened for the final time he has sex with and subsequently murders a clone of his daughter prior to committing suicide."
[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessier_Ashpool
You can find there rich and poor, genetic modifications only rich can afford, one (lack of the need to sleep) so special that it reshapes world. You can find there universal income as payment for voting. You can find philosophy of exchange through voluntary mutually beneficial contracts promoted by such influential inventor that it raises to the same eminence buddism has. Awesome read.