I'm completely demotivated to work; what can I do?

124 points by iyra72 ↗ HN
I'm two years before heading off to university, but I have no motivation to learn the things that are being taught at college. I chose to study the subjects that I thought I would enjoy, but sadly this isn't true. I'm assuming that if I had made other choices for subjects, I'd be in a similar problem. Maths is one of the subjects I'm studying, and although I enjoy maths itself, I'm not enjoying what I learn in school. I can't be motivated to put the work in, so that I can get good results at the end of the year. I spend my free time programming or researching instead, but I can't continue doing this if I want to get the A-levels I need to enter a half-decent university.

Are there any ways by which I could motivate myself to study more?

134 comments

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Aniracetam (or Oxiracetam, if Aniracetam doesn't work for you) + DMAE. Don't forget to balance your blood pressure, use venous or arterial drugs to enhance whole body blood flow (don't use drugs that work only locally). If you don't want to use blood-related drugs, then just exercise regularly (try to focus only on resistance-oriented exercises). Try to sleep on a hard bed without any pillows. Also, increase your metabolism and energy by drinking a cup or three of coffee in first half of day and eating a big (300+ grams) portion of boiled grains + a good piece of meat, but with small amounts of fat. And don't forget to eat a lot of fruits - primarily oranges, apples, bananas and pears.
If we are suggesting drugs, may as well throw in a suggestion for amphetamines.

But personally, I would recommend intense and sustained cardiovascular exercise.

Adderall would make anything fun.
modafinil. your solution, for dire needs ofcourse
I take an amphetamine pro-drug (Vyvanse) and I'm incredibly reluctant to recommend it any time someone expresses trouble with motivation/focus.

But it did change my life at that critical I-don't-know-how-I'll-make-it-through-university moment. Especially when everyone around me offered stellar advice like "try harder" and "don't buy in to the Big Pharma ADD/ADHD-conspiracy".

It turns out that I'm also reluctant to just offer "exercise more!" or "work on yourself -- it's your behavior!". It's frustrating and anxiety-inducing enough to struggle with motivation. If the only solution is to put pressure on such people by suggesting it's all in their head, then what do we do if that pressure doesn't actually fix anything? Do we count down to the catastrophe so that we can chime in one last time with "See? Look what you did."?

Exercising and taking a sabbatical are good advice, but sabbaticals are out of the question for most people (especially a kid in highschool), and exercise is only that -- good advice.

At some point we have to admit that the results of no-improvement will out-trouble our concerns/stigma over last resorts like medication.

Don't compare aniracetam or oxi to amphetamines (or ritalin) - the former is legal and safe enough, and the latter is much more dangerous and ineffective (in terms of concentration enhancing). I would never ever recommend amphetamines nor ritalin, cannabis or other "useful" drugs, that always make you want to take more of them. All what they can give is faster burnout of your brain and state of lack of energy (also, problems with your skin, thanks to amphetamine overdose).

What OP was talking about was not psychostimulation, but concentration enhancer, something that would just reduce effects of "mind wandering" and let him do tasks that he doesn't want to otherwise.

Aniracetam and oxi do greatly reduce effects of "mind wandering", large amounts of grains and fruits give your brain very much glucose, i.e. energy to use to, coffee increases your metabolism and blood flow, and gives a slight stimulation, so you can force yourself to do task more easily.

Don't overuse coffee, though, it's effects can last from 1 to 3 days (or even more).

Some of the nootropics are Prescription Only Medications.

Being arrested for possession would have some negative consequences for OP. Accepting a caution would be worse.

So, if OP does want to try this be careful about the legal status and if the police do call be polite but say, firmly and clearly, that you'll answer their questions after you've spoken to a lawyer, and refuse to say anything else.

I've never used aniracetam and can't advocate one way or the other, but it looks like aniracetam is OTC in the UK (where it sounds like OP lives) and freely available from amazon.co.uk.
Step back and ask yourself: What are my assumptions? Why do I believe these assumptions to be true? What if they aren't true?

You have at least 50 years ahead of you. That's a long time. But the next 5 years will profoundly shape your next 50.

If that feels like too much pressure, then simply don't worry about it. It's more important to relax than to optimize your life if you're the type of person who doesn't react well to a lot of pressure.

I know it seems like what you learn in school is boring, and perhaps even trivial, but it provides an important foundation to what you'll learn in University.

When I was in high school, I'd attempt to apply the stuff I was learning in math to more interesting problems that I was actually interested in – for example, using the simple calculus I was being taught to start to understand some aspects of machine learning.

The truth is, a lot of high school math is rather fascinating – you just need to find a place to apply what you're learning. I still use that technique now; I find a lot of the electronics courses at university extremely dull, so I'll write a program to solve, say, a diode circuit using the exponential model. And I end up learning so much more than I would just studying.

So studying high school math and learning interesting things doesn't have to be mutually exclusive :)

Open a map, close your eyes and point randomly. Pack you backpack, buy tickets and go there without any reservation. Spend at least 1 month away from home, comfort and routine.

When you are back you will know exactly what to do.

> Open a map, close your eyes and point randomly. Pack you backpack, buy tickets and go there without any reservation. Spend at least 1 month away from home, comfort and routine.

This sounds like an interesting and exciting life-changing plan and everything, but I don't think it's particularly actionable advice for most sixteen-year-olds in today's world, and I don't think it's likely to help with the question at hand. The submitter isn't asking /what to do/; the submitter is asking /how can I be more motivated in what I'm doing/!

I think better advice is to focus on how the things you're learning relate to the things you like to do. So try to focus on how math can improve your programming, research, and other interests. Also, keep in mind that you're building a foundation--things are more interesting once you get to the stage where you're building on top of it. Even if you decide not to use it in a few years, it's a really nice thing to have that will give you a lot of flexibility.

I think we can abstract the advice you're commenting on to "if you don't feel motivated to do what you're doing, do something else", which seems okay. It's quite possible that continuing to do things you are not enthusiastic about doing may be a bad idea.

I see your point that it's not a very actionable bit of real advice. Pragmatically, if you told my 16 year old to pack a bag and leave, I'd want to smack you :D

Sixteen is old enough - especially when he can always return. Being away from everything for a few months really puts things into perspective - why are you doing what you're doing, why you were so afraid of some things, whether you're on the right path, and more.
The weakness of the advice isn't that it might not be helpful and mind-expanding. It falls short in that most sixteen-year-olds probably don't really have the option to do it:

1) The plan takes more than a trivial amount of money. Most sixteen-year-olds cannot afford this sort of plan.

2) Many parents, if not most parents, are unlikely to support this idea. There's of course a spectrum of what parents might do to stop it if they're not supportive, but it's easier to just save up money and wait until you're done with school.

3) It can only be done in the summer without causing a lot of problems, and perhaps not even then.

It's a potentially helpful suggestion for someone who's over eighteen, but for many sixteen-year-olds it's probably a pipe dream or something that may bring more problems than benefits. The suggestion assumes a certain type of parents and a certain level of privilege that I would estimate are the exception and not the norm. I would have been extremely frustrated if someone gave me advice that presented this as a serious option when I was sixteen.

Advice that makes these sort of assumptions may end up decreasing motivation. I think more universal advice that addresses the actual question is a lot more helpful.

Old enough for your kid, maybe :D Not old enough for mine, in my state, to not be legally responsible for them, as far as I know (I suppose I could be mistaken, though).

I can agree that distance creates perspective. All I am saying is that if my 16 year old daughter told me she was going to set out for some random spot for a month, I'd probably nix the idea and not feel like I was being unreasonable.

Take it easy, there are lot of options available online if you are not enjoying what is being taught in college but you have interest in particular subject. For e.g.: When I was in college I felt my profs. are boring , so I always used to take online courses , like algorithms , operating system through ocw.mit.edu or stanford.edu or coursera , It helped me a lot to maintain interest in subject , and at same time participate in discussions online , there is always a big community somewhere which will be happy to help you .
Fuck school, it has no intrinsic value. It's not an end in itself, and it's not built for everyone. If it's not built for you, find something you DO like and dive into it hard. You're on hacker news for some reason -- what is it you're into? Learn how to do it yourself, get technical, build skills around that. Also, make friends who are likewise into it. I promise you'll be a lot more engaged.

Do the school work but do it with something else in mind.

Also: the guys suggesting drugs know nothing about you and are probably not doctors. I love drugs, but I'd never suggest them without knowing more about you. It's absurdly easy to build a serious amphetamine dependency that will leave you feeling a lot worse than you do now.

Exercise. Relatively new discovery that lactic acid, that comes from muscle use, is a "pre-cursor" for motivation.
Counter-example: Me, I don't work out. I work 9-5 at a tech job and then spend the weekend working on my own products. I don't struggle with motivation as I literally enjoy what I do.

Always question advice that people like to rattle off - humans are very good at perpetuating bad memes without a second thought. Like that running a marathon (26 miles) in one go is somehow healthy, without ever questioning why a healthy activity would make them shit their pants and nipples bleed.

In fact exercising would probably decrease the probability that I would be productive as it would consume more of my time and energy.

My 0.02

Drop out and find something that motivates you. It's harder than the standard path, but if you're bright and industrious it can be a much more interesting ride. Also, university is always there later. I did the above, got bored in my second successful career and am now finishing up a Ph.D. that I started, as an undergrad, at the age of 27. I think I got more out of the program than my younger counterparts, and thanks to a decade of making money and connections, I did it in significantly better style. No regrets.
Do you have a job? Go push a mop for a couple years. It will motivate you to do well in school and has the added benefit of giving you some money for university.
I actually second this. I worked a bunch of odd jobs starting at 15 years old (you were supposed to be 16, so I had to get consent from the principal to flip burgers). As I was taking the garbage out while working at a grocery store, it just hit me: I can't do this for the rest of my life. I believe I was around 18 years old, so maybe a little older than the OP. I joined the local chamber of commerce and started consulting that summer and made more money than the previous 3 summers, and I enjoyed the work I was doing.

It's good to work awful jobs. It builds healthy character and eventually it'll probably hit you that you really want to be doing more intellectual things, which conveniently pays more money than most physical labor.

It's nice to chip away at programming but if you don't have an academic basis to guide your studies it is going to keep you out of a lot of jobs when you get out. Take it from someone who knows - I've programmed useful things in just about every language, but because I didn't major in Computer Science (Physics/Philosophy instead) I'm unable to compete for the top tier of jobs. Hopefully this isn't permanent, as I'm teaching myself computer science now, but I could've saved myself a lot of work if I had just chosen a concentration more suitable for the jobs I was interested in.

You may be a confident auto-didact but even auto-didacts tend to have large blind spots. You don't know what you don't know, and school is there to tell you.

I don't know where you are, but if you're in the U.S. (or even if you're not), feel free to drop me a line. Some of the best developers I know come from non-CS backgrounds and I know folks who are always looking. Email's in my profile.
As a Computer ENGINEER, I can easily tell you that Computer SCIENCE is essentially a liberal arts degree. Seriously, they don't know st about technology, unless it comes safely wrapped in an API.

And by the way, studying Physics is orders of magnitude more difficult that learning CS. And for that alone, I would hire a Physicist over a CS guy any day of the week.

Ask any recruiter, and they'll tell you the same thing. Physics is a higher pecking order than CS.

Your soul is probably waking up. That's the black lung of coding.

You have three, maybe four choices. Visual arts, music, and writing, with performing with an asterisk (it's not for everyone.) Get used to being a lot poorer, but happier.

Take it from someone who fucked up and went for arts:

You get demotivated there too. At least with math and programming jobs, you have some money to fix things.

But, as someone who also went towards the arts (I'm a regularly gigging musician) and letters (I have a BA in Philosophy and dumpped my PhD during my dissertation), I can say that it wasn't super hard to get back into a technical position coming from a high-school and early college education where I learned a lot of logic, math, and programming skills... since leaving my PhD program I've been consulting doing PHP-based development for the last 4 years, and I'm on track career wise as I would have been if I was teaching at a university somewhere.

This is wholly a un-based feeling, but I feel that it has been a lot easier to pick up new and professionally useful technical skills in my 30s than it would have been if I had done well in my 20s with a technical career and had to pick up the useful philosophical and musical skills I enjoy using in my 30s.

It sometimes helps to study the history of whatever subject you are working towards in school. For example, the history of mathematics can provide a lot of inspiration for what can be done with the knowledge. Focus on the outcomes you want and see the schooling as a means to an end.
Pick up a copy of Cal Newport's book "So Good They Can't Ignore You." Read that book and then think about your situation some more. Cal brings up some very interesting observations, and you're at the perfect point in your life to read it.
So you don't like school work. You could get higher grades if only you were more motivated...

i.e. you are exactly like every other 16 year old I ever knew.

Most of them because more motivated once they started university and were able to focus on what they enjoyed studying. I'd be more worried if you were motivated at 16, because then you'd probably burn out, or grow up to be an obnoxious brain box.

Also, since you sound like you are in the UK, you should realise that grades don't matter here. No-one will ever ask what you scored in your maths A-level. Your success in life will mostly be determined by the connections your parents have. The only thing you can do to improve your chances is network and make some more connections of your own at university. Plenty of top jobs go to those who graduated with the "gentleman's third" because they spent their time networking rather than studying.

> Your success in life will mostly be determined by the connections your parents have

Sorry but this statement doesn't ring true to me, because I know of several cases where two brothers have had divergent success outcomes based on their personalities and the choices they've made.

There's also MANY ways to forge your own connections in life.

You're completely right. It's not true. Your success in life will mostly be determined by the connections you make.
It's also likely you inherit the connections your parents make - provided you maintain a good relationship with them. Everyone once in a while, I'll heard about a guy by mum knows who needs some work done on his website. Since my mum is an assistant in Tesco, these are not stupendous opportunities (though not to discredit, I can use the money).

If my mum or dad was an investment banker and I was still a web developer, I imagine they would still send leads my way. There just may be more in quantity or monetary value or both.

I recently saw this documentary, 'Who gets the best jobs'[1]. It overwhelmingly supports OP's stance.

1.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bD7U8kqI8A

I find anecdotal evidence to be more valuable.
Statistical evidence is always the best (assuming it's done right)
> Statistical evidence is always the best

Do you have the numbers to back that up?

OP has to get into university first.

They're not likely to do that if they drop out of A level study now.

>you are exactly like every other 16 year old I ever knew.

Really? Because when I was in high school I knew plenty of ridiculously overachieving 16 year olds.

Wait, your two years from going to college? That makes you what, 16?
There are none, if you don't feel it then it's not there.

Or you could follow the advice other people had leave here... and eventually you will come back to this same situation but when you are 50 and tired...

Seriously dude, my advice, if you don't feel it leave it; and if you don't feel nothing anywhere then do nothing, many cool things happen when you are "doing nothing".

One way to overcome a lack of motivation is to ruthlessly eliminate distractions. Tailor your environment and to be (and practice habits that are) maximally conducive to studying. If you have a hard time "taking a step back" to take an objective look at your habits and lifestyle, you might find yoga and meditation helpful.

Exercise can also help keep your energy up, but in my experience exercise doesn't magically solve motivation problems and sometimes gets in the way. Working a hard labor can give you good experience but I think the motivation that comes from that sort of work tends to be vastly overstated and wears off very quickly.

Do you spend time programming because you're motivated to program? Have you produced anything of value? What sort of research do you do? What motivates you besides programming and research? Who is paying the bills right now?

> spend my free time programming

Sounds like you enjoy programming. Assuming this is a correct assumption, go all in on it and start contributing to open source projects. If you have the talent then you might be able to get a good job out of high school. At the very least, you might want to look into Computer Science programs in University.

You have a temporary hurdle to jump over. Get good grades. The aim of getting good grades is only to get good grades. There's a bunch of stuff that you can do with good grades, and if that motivates you it's great. But at the moment you just need to get the good grades.

So, perhaps when you're studying you put in 30 minutes for school work, and 15 minutes for what you enjoy, then have a break. Then repeat that.

This allows you to get the good grades, and keeps you interested in the subject.

You'll have a bit more freedom in Uni, and you'll so you can see your current task (get good grades) as also being "learn some discipline".

There will be some people who want to get better grades than you. Thus, you should get best grades you can just to stick one in the eye of those people.

This is very good advice. If you get nothing else out of high school, make sure you learn the discipline it takes to study something that's not immediately rewarding. Not only is it important right now in order to have choices for the immediate future, it's a skill that will serve you well throughout life.
Working for good grades caused me to get burnt out on school. What has motivated me to learn more than anything has been due to being engrossed by the value of the learnings application. If you can be motivated by increasing a grade letter, more power to you. But I argue that a student focused on a grade is going to get less out of the education than someone fixated on a subject for its own merit.
Researching? Tell me you don't mean reading random wikipedia articles and browsing the web here.

You're at the stage of life where you need to develop deep skills in subjects. At the early stages of that process it can be hard to motivate yourself. You're gonna have to power through and realise you're doing this for future you not current you.

Hey there! From the sound of it, you're about sixteen years old and live in Britain. A few years ago, I was your age and in a similar position. What grades are you getting at the minute? A-levels might be easier for you than you realise.

As to how to motivate yourself to study for them... study the cool things you can do with maths. Try to solve problems. Calculus, linear algebra and statistics are the fundament of the maths curriculum, and they're all hugely useful. Figure out how to prove things. Figure out how to solve mechanics problems with calculus. Program some statistical analysis stuff.

Frankly, if you're a smart kid and enjoy maths/programming, I expect you'll do fine at A-level. And if not, it doesn't mean much. Some of the best programmers I know didn't bother going to university.

Sounds just like me at 16. Wasn't very motivated despite studying the A-Levels I wanted to (Maths, Physics, Computing). Spent all my spare time stealing Internet access at the local University (this was back in 1992/1993). I got decent grades (AAB) and got into my first choice University, but the motivation to do well still wasn't there. Ended up getting a 2:2 where everyone expected me to get a 1st. After that I was lucky and ended up in a good job where degree result didn't matter.

Looking back I wish I'd talked to someone (not my parents) about it at the time. So I'd recommend finding someone to talk to at your college; your form tutor (depends, I didn't get on with mine), careers advisor, pastoral care reps, etc. Just remember that they should be there to help you do your best, not bollock you for not putting your full effort in.

First thing - don't search for motivation or don't try to get yourself motivated. You'll end up looking for things that will make you feel good which will in-turn promote procrastination and thereby take you away from actions. The truth is motivation doesn't last. It's a push mechanism. You'll have to focus on things that pull you towards it.

If you keep going like the way you are currently, how would your life be? Definitely you understand the problem with it and this post is the proof. But ask yourself - "why do you want to get A-levels at school?". If programming and researching keeps you going, by all means, you should focus on it. Make sure you put the best possible efforts in it; the rest will follow automatically.

Go and visit your local big council estate. Poor futureless unfortunates should give you some mojo. Or even just watch Benefits Street
> Are there any ways by which I could motivate myself to study more?

Probably not, if you're asking the question. But I don't think you should study more. I think you should program more, since it's already something you enjoy enough to do for fun. It's a question of playing to your strengths.

Put in the 10,000 hours of sustained effort that it takes to truly become great at it. Prove your abilities through open source.

You will have no problem finding an interesting and well-paying career, if you push yourself hard to always keep learning both about programming and about the business of software.

If that sounds like a lot of hard work, well yeah, it is. There's no shortcut. Either suck it up and do your homework and color inside the lines, or summon the guts to blaze your own path. Or do neither and let the path of least resistance take you where it wants.

Which path are you more likely to regret 40 years from now?

I'm not sure it's advisable to encourage somebody not to do well on their A-levels. It's not like the US where you can get low marks in secondary school and be fine. He won't be able to attend a decent university, ever. Correct me if I'm wrong.
This is true, sadly.
The same logic applies in the US. You won't be going to a good college if you have bad high school grades.

But my advice was to consider eschewing academia entirely. I've worked with too many well-paid, respected developers without degrees to take the value of credentialing very seriously.

It's not a panacea, of course. It takes a lot of sustained work and learning whether you do it in school or not. Some people just find it easier to learn outside of formal schooling.

I think it's better to make that decision when you're 18, not 16. Always best to keep your options open because you don't know how you or the world will change, even in the near future.