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Scott Adams: Giving Stuff Away on the Internet (online.wsj.com)

25 points by emfle ↗ HN
"So I've been watching with great interest as the band "Radiohead" pursues its experiment with pay-what-you-want downloads on the Internet. In the near term, the goodwill has inspired lots of people to pay. But I suspect many of them are placing a bet that paying a few bucks now will inspire all of their favorite bands to offer similar deals. That's when the market value of music will approach zero."

25 comments

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mattmaroon
I've been arguing for a very long time against people who think free is a possible business model for art forms. Voluntary payments/micropayments will never work.

dood
I would argue that micropayments will work one day: people are ready and willing to make micropayments, the barrier is the cognitive cost of making the payment. If there were some well-established way to give money with a couple of clicks and zero thought, I think a lot of people would do it.
mattmaroon
Yeah, I'm not buying it. There's no evidence pointing to that whatsoever, and it seems silly to assume that, by default, people will pay for something they didn't have to. That's not human nature. You'd have to assume the opposite until proven otherwise.
dood
I'm not assuming everyone will pay, just a large enough fraction to be significant for moderately popular sites. I think (hope?) you underestimate human nature, or at least the powers of fandom, guilt, and some occasional generosity.

If this sort of thing does take off, I imagine it would work best with the sorts of things people are passionate about, and especially would want to support continuing development; open source software, tutorials/textbooks, music, fiction, webcomics, that sort of thing.

emfle
The concept of reciprocity may very well be hardcoded in human nature, because it is such an effective strategy.
dood
Exactly what I meant to say but somehow missed, thanks!
mattmaroon
I don't think so. Humans typically display that behavior in person, but not behind each other's backs. Humans aren't hard coded to actually be fair, they're only hard coded to give that appearance.

pg
I think most people feel bad when they do something mean and good when they do something virtuous, even when no one is watching. It's hard to say whether it's nature or nurture, but it's definitely there.
jey
"It's hard to say whether it's nature or nurture ..."

The (extremely fascinating) field of evolutionary psychology gives some pretty convincing arguments that our brains are hard-wired for reciprocal altruism. Hard-wiring of reciprocal altruism in the form of emotions like guilt and gratitude is one of the main reasons humans can form these large and mostly stable social structures.

EvPsych basically makes one important observation and asks the natural question leading from it: Just like our eyes and hands, our minds have also been developed in response to evolutionary pressures. What were these pressures and how do they account for the features we see in ourselves, like language, love, laughter, crying, etc?

corentin
Yes, if by "something mean" you imply that there is some damage (e.g. if you break your neighbor's window when no one is watching). When you download some file, you can't do damage.

I both pirate and buy movies, music, books, etc. Whether I choose to pirate or buy something is only a matter of convenience, not a matter of moral. I bought your books while they are available legally and for free on the web just because I prefer the convenience of a book to badly rendered fonts on a LCD screen, not because I felt good giving you money :)

edit: it's no surprise that a fundamental assumption of economics is that individuals only act in their interest.

andreyf
...it seems silly to assume that, by default, people will pay for something they didn't have to. That's not human nature.

Then why do people on vacation leave tips after dinner?

mattmaroon
People who aren't on vacation leave tips too. And because it's a finely ingrained custom. There's a real person in front of you who will not get paid if you don't tip them, and you see them and they see you.

To most people, Britney Spears is not real. They don't know her, and don't care about her. They won't pay her a cent for her new album because they don't have to face her in person.

dood
What about Radiohead?
paulgb
Novelty may have been a factor.
greendestiny
Coming from a country that doesn't tip, I agree completely about that tipping is all about custom and social expectation. Its not a transaction that makes a lot of sense without a lot of societal rules governing it. I certainly don't think that markets that operate with tipping run more efficiently than they would without.

The desires that might lead to a micropayment, like for respect and identification with a particular band, would perhaps be better served with a different macro good. If you can get the music for free, then you're paying out of a want to support and connect with the band, maybe that would be better served by asking people to buy a t-shirt or something.

emfle
That the tip is a percentage of the bill makes no sense whatsoever. Bringing you Filets de venaison frits sur leur sauce a l'echalote is no more work than bringing you a Sloppy Joe with fries.

The only explanation I can think of is that it is a way for restaurant owners to encourage waiters to encourage customers to buy expensive, high-margin food.

greendestiny
That's what working on commission does. Tipping is just working on commission but with a bunch randomness and social rules as obtuse as victorian era manners.
earthboundkid
It also means that waiters at expensive restaurants can expect to earn more in tips. So, they get the more experienced waiters.
andreyf
According to a food-aware friend of mine, the waiter who brings you Filets de venaison frits sur leur sauce a l'echalote should be able to explain to you exactly what ingredients went into the food, how it's made, and a lot of other intricacies about your meal.
andreyf
I agree that Britney Spears will not be able to make it in a tip-based music industry.
danw
The mobile web is going to be great in this regard since users are used to paying for everything and quick easy payment solutions are already in place. As for online solution take a look at http://tipit.to/
mikesabat
Mobile may help solve this issue, but I think it is going to take a long time, especially in the USA.

I am betting that the form of "free" content will add value - www.shelfmade.net

Mistone
i think its a fascinating problem and don't feel current options (adverts or donations) are addressing. tim orielly points out that there is not a one size fits all solution. when the content/media/art is the product it becomes increasingly more important than if your a casual blogger.