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Ask HN: Help with offer negotiation

6 points by verite ↗ HN
i got a job offer with a highly reputable startup with ~30 employees and a 50m valuation.

i am a software engineer with a top b.s., state school m.s., and two years of experience (in which i was very successful). i am currently unemployed; my last salary was 96k and i had 0.2% of a 40 employee / 20m valuation company.

i was offered 100k and 0.07%. i thought the equity offered was very low, and asked for 100k and 0.22%. the company came back with 106k and 0.07%, or 100k and 0.08% (i guess they want to keep their equity). they claimed that this offer is in 75th percentile of comparable companies.

i am talking to them in person tomorrow. i'm scraping salary data from angel.co at the moment. what else should i do/know?

thanks!

14 comments

[ 3.0 ms ] story [ 41.2 ms ] thread
byoung2
Where is this company located? If it's Silicon Valley, those numbers are very low. If it's Idaho, that's a different story. So we need to know that, and more importantly, we need to know what salary you want (is the $100k and 0.22% what you really want, or what you thought they'd agree to?).

First of all, I hope you didn't tell them that $96k number before they offered $100k. If so, you screwed yourself by anchoring your offer to a low previous salary.

Second, if they are even discussing salary, it means they like you and they have already mentally committed to you. Going back to the drawing board will mean weeks or months of reading resumes, interviews, negotiations, and possibly recruiting fees which will cost easily $20-40k. In that light, giving you $20k extra would be a bargain. The fact that they went from $96k to $106k proves that.

Third, I wouldn't let equity be the deciding factor (that could just be me), since it could be worth $0 (and 90% of the time it probably is).

As far as negotiating, I suggest you read this post in full: http://www.kalzumeus.com/2012/01/23/salary-negotiation/

verite
Thanks for your help! I am certain that they like me -- I mean, I have an official paper offer that I can sign.

It is in Silicon Valley. I haven't disclosed salary history.

I thought they may agree to 100k and 0.2%, and/or I could use that as leverage to ask for more salary instead.

I would be happy with 100k and 0.2%, 120k and 0%, or anything scaled in between.

I had already read that post.

verite
Er, nevermind I guess. My (written) offer got rescinded.
byoung2
Yeah that's probably for the best. They sound like cheapskates anyway. Next job offer, tell them you want 130k and let them offer 110k. Show them you're a team player by offering to meet in the middle on salary at 120k, but ask for more equity to make up for the 10k you're giving up!
rgovind
Did they take it back because of this post in hacker news or because they didn't like the higher salary request.
verite
i'm not sure i will ever get to find out why they took it back. but i think it is very unlikely that it is this post in HN. someone would have to be checking HN very religiously.
crazypyro
You did provide a great amount of detail that could probably be used to identify you. Giving (real?) exact numbers doesn't help either. I would be more careful about disguising career questions in the future, even if this post wasn't the cause.
rgovind
You should she them just to find out why :P Btw, now that you don't care, can you please tell which company this is.
verite
This is a really frivolous reason to sue. I don't currently want to out the company; if in the future I do, it would probably not be in a random HN comment :).
andrewhillman
While I was reading your 'ask,' I was thinking... too much info, someone at the company is going to see this. I hope this isn't the case and I am sure you will find another position.
logn
But 100K at .2% and 120K at .0% means you value them at $10m. Their counter to you revealed they value themselves at $60m. And their valuation of record is $50m. I'd counter with .05% and $120K which they might counter with .05% and $118K.
verite
the salaries are yearly and the % is over 4 years
chadkruse
> they claimed that this offer is in 75th percentile of comparable companies.

Empirical data is the best data: https://angel.co/salaries

Bummed OP had the original offer rescinded, but for anyone reading this in the future, a quick Google search for "startup salary survey" should bring up a few additional resources. I've filled a number of these out in the past and the data is always awesome. Lots of 'em are behind paywalls though, so beware.

verite
I think AngelList is not strictly speaking empirical data -- it is what a company provides as advertisement, not what it is actually paying.

How one decides "empirical data", as well as "comparable companies" and "comparable candidate" are all subject to very broad interpretation.

For instance, GlassDoor has way lower salary numbers than AngelList. But they have their share of problems too -- while the numbers are empirical, they are often dated (and have no account of equity compensation)