I'm 25 years old and I am lost
Now, I've quit my job at that company because I just couldn't work there any longer. And am trying to figure out what to do next.
I know for a fact that I want to run my own business and attain financial freedom but I can't risk another startup at this moment because: 1. Startups are tough and I am afraid 2. I have a few financial responsibilities towards my family which I have to take care of.
Thus, I have picked up another job which I'll join in a few weeks. It is not in a very 'sexy' or 'trendy' industry and I have no idea where it is going to take me in two years.
What do you do when you believe that you can do great things but something that you have no control over is holding you back? You believe that you are good at what you do and are meant for great things but you have to do your job even though it doesn't do justice to your capabilities. How do you cope with that? Seeing your future as an underachiever pains you. What do you do?
In the course of trying to figure it out, I spoke to my friends about this, I realised that most of them are going through the same thing. But they haven't figured out how to deal with it. I don't know if this is what they call a quarter-life crisis.
Thus, this is as much a distress call as it is a rant. And not having anyone else to turn to, I am posting it here at HN assuming that this is not just a problem for a handful of people but a general problem for people who believe in their ability to do great things (whether it is true or not is irrelevant to them).
The questions I posed here aren't the only ones I have in my mind. But, I hope I have been able to convey the message. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks!
273 comments
[ 5.3 ms ] story [ 263 ms ] threadIf it isn't fulfilling then don't do it.
So, don't feel bad doing a job. Nothing is beneath you, and everything is always a stepping stone between where you are now and where you will be later.
Take care of your financial situation and push on with your new startup.
It is easy to feel panicked when facing a situation you want to change, but I'm sure if you reflect upon your life you've felt that way before and made it through. Problems ahead can often seem insurmountable but few things in life actually are.
1) You're 25 years old, and already have one acqui-hire under your belt. That's pretty impressive. Considering probably 90%? 99%? of people will never have a startup they build acquired under any circumstances, it seems weird to describe yourself as an underachiever.
There's this weird cult of young entrepreneurship, where it's implied that if you're in your 20s, you must be founding companies or you're just wasting your time.
I'll throw something out there instead - why not spend the next few years working at your day job and trying to learn how to be a better startup founder the next time you do it? Think of it like being in training for the next gig.
2) my other perspective on this:
> What do you do when you believe that you can do great things but something that you have no control over is holding you back? You believe that you are good at what you do and are meant for great things but you have to do your job even though it doesn't do justice to your capabilities.
That's called "adulthood". Sometimes you have responsibilities that limit your options or make it hard to do what you love.
I realised recently that my life would be a lot better right now if I worked the so-called soul destroying corporate job because I'd have more money, work fewer hours, have less stress during work, people would expect less from me, I'd have infinitely more holidays, more work-free weekends...
Sometimes its hard to see what you've got until its gone :)
Don't get me wrong, I like being a founder and don't regret it for a minute, but when times get tough I look back and think the soul destroying corporate days were actually pretty good.
Which brings me to this: Life (usually) really is what you make of it.
When we got acquired, I assumed that I would leave as soon as I could and do it all again - but yet, I'm still here. It's interesting work, and while I miss the ability to just get things done, I find that I've been getting a lot better at dealing with problems at scale. So, for example, how DO you launch a new product to a sales and support organization with hundreds of people?
I'm not saying I'll never start a company again, because I really want to, but I'm enjoying feeling like I'm learning how to do things better next time.
I got saddled with "chief scientist", but practically speaking it was "technical field operations and product management", which just ends up being a lot to put on a business card.
Taking a title like that, while actually not doing it is a borderline fraud. If I'll get a resume with "scientist" or "researcher" in the title, the first thing I would look at would be published academic papers. If there are none, I will not consider this resume.
My job evolved to be more of a business-focused role, but my title did not. The intention was never to mislead, and indeed, when asked, I never claimed to be an academic.
> Taking a title like that, while actually not doing it is a borderline fraud
That seems like a strong conclusion to draw. My title now is "Product Architect", but I'm not an architect, nor do I exclusively design products.
A quick skim through Crunchbase yields:
http://www.crunchbase.com/person/jeff-hammerbacher (bright guy, not an academic)
http://www.crunchbase.com/person/bram-cohen (not an academic)
http://www.crunchbase.com/person/chris-slowe (not really an academic)
And that's in the first 10 results. "Fraud" seems strong.
I started planning 3 months before I gave notice. Made sure I had 6 months' savings. Formed an LLC, talked with a business attorney and CPA, and lined up projects before my quit-date. So I was basically ready to go from day 1.
On which side is the grass greener?
Amazing way to put it. I'm 25 myself and this is the only reason why I'm still working for my big corp. Payed school.
I used to think life was a race, but I'm really enjoying the growth and learning parts.
Also, 'great things' can mean different things to different people. Like building a marriage and raising children. Everyone does it, so it can't really be that big of deal. Can it? Try and see...
That is definitely more than most founders can say. Don't let startup hype get to you.
The parent commenter said something else I want to echo: take some time and learn from other leaders right now, make money, get a good emergency fund AND a "startup fund" built. Get your hands dirty in other businesses and see what they're using spreadsheets for and what they are doing repetitively -- that's where you'll (most likely) find your next product opportunity.
There's much more to the story, I had blogged about it but svbtle deactivated my account for no reason and is unreachable. If you're really curious about the story I'd be happy to converse privately over email.
It is really not that weird.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome
What I hate, however, is knowing about imposter syndrome and letting that screw with my mind. I think, "maybe I am using imposter syndrome as a way to sneakily support my ego that is only partially supported by reality. Reality does not support my ego at the inflated levels I want to believe in." But then I think - well, I suppose I have to be smart to trick myself in such a ridiculous way, and conclude I actually am smart. That leads me to think that I am actually an intellectual imposter, and it's traditional that I take that as a truth, which my ego has temporarily decided to not believe in, for certain problem kinds.
Lately, I build on top of externally developing habits - like studying, running, meditating, eating healthy, sleeping healthy, working at a normal pace, and having confidence in my own opinions about computer science, logic, mathematics, and programming. This helps me think less about how I perceive myself and how others perceive me, but I can get knocked off my horse once in a while. I just try to remind myself that it's just time wasted that I could use studying, working, or helping other people - which is more thinking about the long long term, rather than each individual achievement.
You just need initiate and bootstrap the idea yourself on the side quietly, then when ready for demo, show it to your boss and ask for some sponsorship to keep working on it (you gotta make sure it has clear business impact for them) Most reasonable bosses will allow for some time invested in new and interesting ideas. If your boss always shoots it down then find a new boss.
This part of your post sticks out like a sore thumb. What "things?" How will you know when the "things" you have "done" are "great" enough? What makes you think you are "meant" for them? What does "meant" mean? Was your birth heralded by a double rainbow or something?
I'm betting that "great" is defined relative to some imagined ideal that you can never reach, or which you will constantly shift to ensure your own continuing dissatisfaction.
Decide what you want.
A good family and children, personal happiness, friendships, love. These things make a person happy and satisfied. Even relationships I've had when waiting tables and the pride I took in doing that work was extremely satisfying (even if the hours were bad and the pay mediocre). But that was because of my attitude and goals, not because of the work.
Now, I work at a very very large software company doing interesting, challenging work and am paid well for it. Despite all my great coworkers and satisfaction in doing my job, they are not going to keep me company or be my real friends at the end of the day.
Work to live, my friend, don't live to work.
No one knows the future. The best experiences of my life have been things I hadn't even thought about a year before they happened.
> You believe that you are good at what you do and are meant for great things but you have to do your job even though it doesn't do justice to your capabilities
Spend one hour per day working on your own project idea. Maybe it will turn into something, maybe not. But at least it will be something you own and you'll learn a lot from it. Does it suck that progress will be slow? Yes. But 1 hour per day over the course of two years can add up to something pretty impressive.
I have gone through periods of burn out and extreme passion about my startups. Sometimes it's nice to have a steady paying job and be stress free for a while. That's you biding your time until the right idea/opportunity comes along.
I went through an acquihire myself. Don't feel bad, startups are a longshot, and to see any positive outcome is much better than nothing. I worked for that company for 2 years, became frustrated, had an idea I was excited about, and then started something new.
So my advice is, take the stress-free job until you build up the passion to work on something new. And then do it.
EDIT: typo
A startup is a new business that is still investigating what kind of product it is going to sell, and to which audience.
For one I raised $1.7m in money over the years several years ago, but then had to scale it back due to lack of success. I pivoted it to a site that now has millions of visitors per month, but I run it solo trying to figure out how to make money and grow it.
The other company is just two us, my cofounder and I created a social media analytics platform and we have done about $150k of revenue in bootstrap mode in the past year or so. We are now trying to push a product to the masses and may look for funding soon.
Aim to save the maximum humanly possible (reduce spend/be frugal) to give you potential budget or run-way for your next project. Start it while you are employed, work on it when you are at work. Be a terrible employee while more-or-less still looking good... but vest your time in new projects or ideas, or exposing yourself to where you might find them (not pointless crap like most other bad employees do).
Personally, I am in the latter stages of 'medicore job' period after a very similar gig at a fairly similar age (few yrs older). I am hitting 70% net wage savings rate and have one project in-hand progressing reasonably well and a bigger/ambitious project in the works. I spend the majority of my work day working on these projects while still delivering for my job - I really dislike working for someone else but, as a means to an end, this is pretty cushy.
Good luck what ever you choose, it's likely that there are no bad choices right now which is why you're feeling like this.
* You should be really proud of your achievements so far, an acqui-hire is no joke.
* I understand you may be afraid of starting or joining a risky startup. But what have you got to lose? At age 25, you can live a scrappy life, there's no social pressure not be a salary man anymore these days, especially in a startup scene where it's so normal. You're young and can take the risk.
* Third, the only point that really matters in my opinion, is the people you have to provide for. If there's no way around it, there's no way around it. I know what that's like and I respect that. Just make sure to check your assumtions carefully. I'd had to take care of my sick dad for a long time, but wouldn't throw away an opportunity I really believed in, as he'd hate himself if he was an obstacle, and he'd still have my mom and my bro, and I'd still be able to support him partially. Talk to those who you support, and consider if they really depend on you. Sometimes there's room to juggle both, sometimes it's possible to find an alternative caretaker.
Lastly, there's quite a few startups that are challenging and do pay decently from the get go. Bitcoin is a fun space for example, and Bitpay and Coinbase pay well, yet exist in a challenging and ever in-flux ecosystem.
Cultivate a rich life and identity outside of work. It's hard but what we do doesn't have to be what defines us.
Here's the thing, I was worried about going backwards in my carrier when I went to work for the insurance company, but instead it taught me discipline and gave me the chance to learn from veteran programmers. I would not trade in those years for a new startup firm.
Don't feel like you're giving up just because you have to step back a bit. Use it as a chance to get a different perspective on our industry.
http://www.ted.com/talks/larry_smith_why_you_will_fail_to_ha...
and this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Fl9LRgG3_A
I find my biggest problem is a lack energy / motivation to start that next thing. I really have no clue where the fuck it came from... a few years ago I could work endlessly...
If you can afford to, take a long vacation. If you can't, try to find something that brings you joy and do that thing every single day, without fail. Beware of burnout, it can cost you years.
http://www.amazon.com/Art-Happiness-Guide-Developing-Importa...
I left the startup world behind and my life satisfaction went through the roof - I no longer felt guilty for not crushing it 100%, or that I hadn't sold a successful company by the age of 24. I'm not saying this is the answer for you, but it's never a bad thing to get some perspective. Get out of the bubble - take a road trip around some states, maybe. Take a break from Hacker News. You and your friends might be chasing the wrong thing.
What are ways to accomplish this without running your own business?
I received some advice a number of years ago which has stuck with me, and served me well.
If there's something you want to do with your life... Don't talk about it. Don't think about it. You'll do so forever.
Just do it. You'll be 50 before you know what the hell happened.
Another advice from a book, which stuck with me: "If you have the desire to do something, do it, because if you wait too long, you will find that the desire has left you long ago."
I have done everything I wanted to do in my 20s. I have a technical/developer background but left my startup career, with no job offer or backup nets, became a SAG actor, and a whole lot more. I even wrote and published a bunch of eBooks on this too.
BEST MOVE EVER.
I now have professional resumes in 3 different industries. Acting, Sales, and Startups. Great diversification. I even joined another startup years later doing something much more fun. The career gap came up, but I just told it like it is. You will find open-minded people who want to work with you.
Now I'm in my early 30s, happily getting ready to settle down. Just follow your heart. It's healthy and normal to yearn for great things. That is because YOU are pure greatness. Those who take action will distinguish themselves from those who don't.
What do I want to do in my thirties? Be a life coach to share my experience to those who find value. Be a great father/life partner. Learn to surf.
This does not mean 'accepting' it and 'acknowledging' that mediocrity is all you're bound to. This means that for the time being, you will make the 'best' of the opportunity 'at hand', you will work for a better one to present itself while eliminating all the negativity and irritation associated with the present.
Changing your mental state, to become a catalyst for progress instead of a shackle, is the actual problem and the real challenge. Work on this point, the rest is relatively clearer (side projects, another startup, better offer, fancier pay, more exciting challenges/problems to solve etc...).
I'm in the same position, at the same age, battling the same demons. The above is my realization after a prolonged phase of depression. 'Work with what you have to reach what you couldn't before'.
You co-founded a company that was acquired - how many people can say that? Even if it was an acqui-hire, does that really make a difference? Why do you feel that this accomplishment is not worthy of praise?
You didn't like working at the parent company and so you left to find different work. What is wrong with that? I would bet that most people on HN have been through a similar circumstance. If you don't like working at a certain place and don't fit it, it's not necessarily your fault or anyone's "fault".
Furthermore, you had the ability and confidence to leave a job you did not like and take a job that perhaps will be a better fit. Why does it matter that it's not in a "sexy" or "trendy" industry? Reading just the big headline stories on HN or other tech websites will leave you a bubble where it seems like everyone is working for an ultra-trendy hipster startup that will be "the next big thing", when in reality many software developers work in more mundane industries but are still very technically astute and have a fulfilling life.
If it's something you can do day after day and it doesn't bother you, in my mind that is great. Don't compare yourself to what others want, compare yourself to what you want.
Which leads me to my next point: Why do you believe that you are an underachiever? Compared to what benchmark? There is nothing wrong with being ambitious - motivation often provides the drive to succeed. But if you are always left wanting more, then you never really get to savour the reward from your efforts and hard work.
Take a step back and try to figure out what really fulfills you in life. Work is often treated as a means to an end, and there's nothing wrong that. However, some people really do relish work and for them, that is an end in an unto itself. But if that's not what fulfills you, you shouldn't try to pigeon-hole yourself into someone else's goals by way of comparison.
Grab that bag of money and go travel if you can. Have a good time, you deserve it.
Instead of saying "I'm annoyed that I can't do these things arg" why not say "I've made a decision to do Y because, and I'm going to make the most of that." Next, try to evaluate whether you are succeeding in that role. Are you learning? Growing? Maybe you're not coding as much but you're learning a crap-ton about how NOT to do things, or about a business domain that has a bunch of meaty problems you can solve later.
Look hard at the things you really want that make you happy (spending time with family, creating things, etc) weigh them, and use that as a new target.
Unfortunately your conundrum is a constant struggle throughout life for those that want to have an impact. First, breathe and relax, and know that it is impossible to do everything all the time. Second, realize that you have a bunch of time left, and there is no formula that determines when in life you can have an impact or be successful. You'll be just fine.