In other naming clash news; I've noticed that a bunch of companies have launched things named Atlas recently:
* hashicorp's application delivery system [1]
* netflix's telemetry platform [2]
* oreilly's new learning environment [3]
* a high-performance and stable proxy for MySQL [4]
* a fitness tracker [5]
* of course, facebook's atlas [6]
"For Zendesk, ideas associated with zen are now deeply ingrained in the company’s culture and branding. The company mascot is a Laughing Buddha, dubbed “The Mentor,” who wears a telephone headset."
They should be very careful doing business in several Buddhist countries with that as their mascot. In a lot of places it would go down about as well as a tech support business called YahwehDesk, promoted with a picture of Jesus in a call center.
Three men (one New Zealander, two locals) have recently been arrested and face trial in Myanmar after promoting their bar with a poster featuring Buddha with headphones:
Personally, when I first heard of Zenpayroll and Zenefits I though they were similar enough services that they might be associated with Zendesk. I think there's definitely possibility of confusion.
Ask any trademark lawyer worth their salt and they'll tell you, "don't put a noun in your company name." That's why you get law firms named Shook, Hardy & Bacon L.L.P. and not ZenLaw, LLC.
This meme that Zen is a philosophy is incredibly unfair / misguided. It's a religion. It's a branch of Mahayana Buddhism, it's practised as a religion, in some regions it still has the aspects of Guru and Deity worship that have been inherited from the larger schools. The full name of the religion is Zen Buddhism.
As someone who has been involved with the religion and with Japanese friends who are also a part of it, it's incredibly belittling when this idea gets spread around. It's only in the West that all of the cultural and religious background has been stripped out and turned into a marketing device.
I often joke that if Buddhism had more extremist members we'd have a lot more holy wars than anyone else. Dressed up Buddhas, Zen stapled onto every two bit startup and cheap product, blogs about consumerist driven minimalism selling themselves as "Zen". It really is ridiculous. What is being done here is just as offensive to eastern cultures as if an East Asian startup branded itself using Christian or Islamic imagery or terms, citing that it's all just "philosophy".
Anyone stealing these terms and imagery really should read some of the critiques of Western misappropriation of Eastern "Spirituality" like "The Scientific Buddha" or "Selling Spirituality". Or even just take five minutes to consider the countries and contexts they might want to operate in as they grow.
I feel a similair way about folks who describe software developers as "ninjas", "samurai", etc. As odd, very misplaced appropriations of east asian themes/imagery.
Especially considering how complex some of the history is with these topics, particularly the Samurai's role in Japanese society, both good and bad, throughout history.
The other really basic, self-centred business concern here is do you ever want to expand into China? Apart from the dis-respect, turning up with a heavy Japanese influence all over your product isn't going to win you any hearts in a lot of regions in China. "Zen at War" and a few other books are a good insight into things like the Nanking Massacre and Buddhism's role in training the more extreme Japanese forces (Kamikaze pilots and etc.).
At a fundamental level, it just all feels a bit racist. We've evolved past drawing buck toothed cartoons in Sanpan hats, these days people would be genuinely horrified at that. But we can still pillage the religions of the regions without a second thought?
Apart from all that, calling someone a "Code Ninja" or "Samurai Developer", or doing programming "Kata" is laughable. We write software, some of it is borderline ok in terms of quality. A lot of us dedicate lots and lots of our waking hours to doing this. It doesn't mean we're some kind of elite. It's another hobby, another job, it earns some money. It's not like any of us are making actual, material sacrifice to achieve these lukewarm heights. Most of it boils down to white collar fantasy rather than anything resembling the intent of these kind of names.
"Why did Zendesk choose laughing buddha as their logo?"
---
Jake Holman, Product Manager, Zendesk -
The Buddha (or "Buddhy" as we sometimes refer to him) isn't actually the logo of Zendesk. It's a common misunderstanding though.
The Zendesk logo is actually a heart-shaped, Lotus flower device followed by the company name, "Zendesk". You'll note the lack of capital D there.
Buddhy is actually what's referred to as a brand "Mascot". He's just a happy little fella that sometimes appears with Zendesk branding, but is not ultimately the logo of Zendesk.
And here is their branding page for "The Buddha (or "Buddhy" as we sometimes refer to him)", which includes an even more amusingly colossal failure of awareness in their "Golden Nuggets from The Mentor", stating: "A picture is worth a thousand words; but if one misuses the picture, those words will be vile and will haunt your children for generations to come.".
>But we can still pillage the religions of the regions without a second thought?
Asia in general is sufficiently alien to the US, both geographically and culturally, that it more or less exists as caricature in many places, and because it's not Christian and European, many don't feel the need to respect it.
There was a tv show called Xena Warrior Princess, that decided to do a story arc where Xena travels to India and fights the Hindu pantheon, because fighting ancient mythological monsters was her shtick. Apparently, the people who made the show were shocked to discover that there were still Hindus in the world, who watched television and weren't happy to find that their religion provided the show's "monsters of the week."
Others can disagree, but I find this a lot less bad. Mostly it's because these are essentially fictional tropes at this point, that have been exported as fiction to the west. Zen is clearly different.
Although there is good reason to speak of the "Zen school" as a distinct branch of the Buddhist tradition of Japan, there has never been any organized social or institutional entity bearing that name. At present, there are twenty-two comprehensive religious corporations (hōkatsu shūkyō hōjin 包括宗教法人) registered with the Japanese government that are recognized as belonging to the Zen tradition (Zenkei 禪系). These include: the Soto School (Sōtōshū 曹洞宗); fifteen separate corporations that identify themselves as branches (ha 派) of the Rinzai lineage (Rinzaishū 臨濟宗); the Ōbaku School (Ōbakushū 黃檗宗); and five small corporations that have splintered off from the Soto and Rinzai organizations. Each of the twenty-two Zen denominations has a number of temples affiliated with it, ranging from 14,664 in the Soto School to 3,389 in the Myōshinji branch of the Rinzai lineage (Rinzaishū Myōshinjiha 臨濟宗妙心寺派), 455 in the Ōbaku School, a few hundred in the smaller Rinzai denominations, and just a handful in the smallest of the corporations (all data from Bunkachō 文化廳, ed., Shūkyō nenkan 宗教年鑑, 2003 Edition).
One thing that clergy affiliated with all the Zen denominations in Japan hold in common is the belief in a Zen lineage (Zenshū 禪宗) of dharma transmission said to have been founded by the Buddha Shakamuni, established in China by the Indian monk Bodaidaruma, and subsequently transmitted to Japan by numerous Japanese and Chinese monks. During the Kamakura period (1185-1333) and the two decades immediately following, by one account, some twenty-four separate branches (ryūha 流派) of the Zen lineage were established in Japan. By another reckoning, there were forty–six individual transmissions of the Zen dharma to Japan, beginning with Myōan Eisai 明庵榮西 (1141-1215) in 1191 and extending down to the Chinese monks Ingen (C. Yinyuan 隱元,1592–1673) and Shinetsu (C. Xinyue 心越, 1639–1696), who came to Japan in 1654 and 1677, respectively, and established the so-called Ōbaku lineage (Ōbakushū 黃檗宗). At present, however, all Zen clergy trace their own lineages of dharma inheritance back to China through only two men: (1) Nanpo Jōmyō 南浦紹明 (1235-1308), a.k.a. Daiō Kokushi, founder of the Daiō branch (Daiōha 大應派) of Rinzai Zen; and (2) Dōgen Kigen 道元希玄 (1200-1253), founder of the Dōgen branch (Dōgenha 道元派) of Soto Zen. All the other branches of the Zen lineage that flourished in the past are said to have died out, having failed at some point to produce any more dharma heirs.
Most of the Zen denominations in Japan operate training monasteries in which the bureaucratic structures, ritual calendars, and modes of practice are modeled after those found in the leading Buddhist monasteries of Song (960-1279) and Yuan (1280-1368) dynasty China. Those institutional forms were first imported into Japan in the Kamakura period, chiefly (but not exclusively) by the same monks who transmitted the Zen lineage. Texts containing the religious lore of the Zen lineage in China - genealogies of dharma transmission, biographies of Zen masters, records of their discourses, and koan collections - were also brought to Japan at that time, and have been handed down to the present within the various denominations as the common heritage of the Zen school.
Even as a lawyer, one becomes weary after a time in seeing how people use the law to abuse others.
The key to this sort of trademark claim is likelihood of confusion or perhaps implied endorsement in having a common-sounding name. Where it is obvious that two companies are in entirely unrelated fields, then the holder of the mark who wants to shut others down had better have a very strong mark such that any use by others of something that sounds similar implies affiliation or endorsement.
There is no way that this is the case with the "zen" prefix.
Even on a personal level, I represented companies known as Zentek Strategy and Zentek Technology, the latter of which became a $2B market cap company before having issues in 2008. We filed and got a registered trademark for "Zentek" and held this from about 1990 through 2008 when the company had some problems and shut its operations. The mark that we registered was not even in Class 9 (where most tech companies file for marks) but in another class because there was already another long-established "zentek" company that held a registered mark in Class 9.
So, wow, the claimant here says, in effect, "we have been using 'zen' since 2007 and so we have a right to claim this exclusively as our own." And it then proceeds to file formal proceedings against all sort of other companies to force them to spend large sums of money or else give up using their marks that share only a common prefix.
Call it what you will. I call this abuse, pure and simple. I can only hope that the people doing this take pride in their coolness as zen proponents even as display the height of arrogance in how they choose to act.
You definetly have a book in you on this topic alone. There
are a lot of people with meager funds who can't afford to
trademark their name, or business--and get bullied. I would
like to see every native born citizen given one free shot
at a trademark. After, that one shot; the price would skyrocket so companies would have to think twice about--3
dozen trademarks.
Mumon said, 'Those who cling onto words are fools who believe that they can catch the moon with a stick or can scratch their itchy foot through a leather shoe.'
It just seems like they're so clearly the most well known "Zen" brand out there. And if this whole thing is about branding, then why not focus on the defensibility of the product rather than the name? Am I being naive here?
This seems like an open threat against Zen Buddhism — Zendesk is trying to gain ownership of the word "Zen". I wonder if we could get some abbots of monasteries to file a claim with the USPTO to revoke Zendesk's trademark?
We use Zendesk at work, and when I saw articles with Zenpayroll in it, I honestly thought it was associated with Zendesk. I'm not sure if that's enough of a bar to allow a lawsuit though, but it is a bit confusing, especially since they both deal with back office SaaS.
>bizarre compound words (Pinterest) have proliferated.
I actually think Pinterest is one of the greater names of recent. You can easily discern that the site is about "interests" and then when you learn about "pinning" items, the name becomes obvious.
47 comments
[ 2.9 ms ] story [ 102 ms ] threadAll of these are up against some already pretty strong SEO for the keyword too:
https://www.google.com/search?q=atlas
They should be very careful doing business in several Buddhist countries with that as their mascot. In a lot of places it would go down about as well as a tech support business called YahwehDesk, promoted with a picture of Jesus in a call center.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/12/13...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_The_Daily_Show_recurrin...
http://marklaw.com/trademark-glossary/confuse.htm
I am going to ditch both.
As someone who has been involved with the religion and with Japanese friends who are also a part of it, it's incredibly belittling when this idea gets spread around. It's only in the West that all of the cultural and religious background has been stripped out and turned into a marketing device.
I often joke that if Buddhism had more extremist members we'd have a lot more holy wars than anyone else. Dressed up Buddhas, Zen stapled onto every two bit startup and cheap product, blogs about consumerist driven minimalism selling themselves as "Zen". It really is ridiculous. What is being done here is just as offensive to eastern cultures as if an East Asian startup branded itself using Christian or Islamic imagery or terms, citing that it's all just "philosophy".
Anyone stealing these terms and imagery really should read some of the critiques of Western misappropriation of Eastern "Spirituality" like "The Scientific Buddha" or "Selling Spirituality". Or even just take five minutes to consider the countries and contexts they might want to operate in as they grow.
The other really basic, self-centred business concern here is do you ever want to expand into China? Apart from the dis-respect, turning up with a heavy Japanese influence all over your product isn't going to win you any hearts in a lot of regions in China. "Zen at War" and a few other books are a good insight into things like the Nanking Massacre and Buddhism's role in training the more extreme Japanese forces (Kamikaze pilots and etc.).
At a fundamental level, it just all feels a bit racist. We've evolved past drawing buck toothed cartoons in Sanpan hats, these days people would be genuinely horrified at that. But we can still pillage the religions of the regions without a second thought?
Apart from all that, calling someone a "Code Ninja" or "Samurai Developer", or doing programming "Kata" is laughable. We write software, some of it is borderline ok in terms of quality. A lot of us dedicate lots and lots of our waking hours to doing this. It doesn't mean we're some kind of elite. It's another hobby, another job, it earns some money. It's not like any of us are making actual, material sacrifice to achieve these lukewarm heights. Most of it boils down to white collar fantasy rather than anything resembling the intent of these kind of names.
"Why did Zendesk choose laughing buddha as their logo?"
---
Jake Holman, Product Manager, Zendesk -
The Buddha (or "Buddhy" as we sometimes refer to him) isn't actually the logo of Zendesk. It's a common misunderstanding though.
The Zendesk logo is actually a heart-shaped, Lotus flower device followed by the company name, "Zendesk". You'll note the lack of capital D there.
Buddhy is actually what's referred to as a brand "Mascot". He's just a happy little fella that sometimes appears with Zendesk branding, but is not ultimately the logo of Zendesk.
---
http://www.quora.com/Why-did-Zendesk-choose-laughing-buddha-...
And here is their branding page for "The Buddha (or "Buddhy" as we sometimes refer to him)", which includes an even more amusingly colossal failure of awareness in their "Golden Nuggets from The Mentor", stating: "A picture is worth a thousand words; but if one misuses the picture, those words will be vile and will haunt your children for generations to come.".
https://www.zendesk.com/company/brand-assets#mentor
I really hope they have issued travel warnings with all their free t-shirts.
Asia in general is sufficiently alien to the US, both geographically and culturally, that it more or less exists as caricature in many places, and because it's not Christian and European, many don't feel the need to respect it.
There was a tv show called Xena Warrior Princess, that decided to do a story arc where Xena travels to India and fights the Hindu pantheon, because fighting ancient mythological monsters was her shtick. Apparently, the people who made the show were shocked to discover that there were still Hindus in the world, who watched television and weren't happy to find that their religion provided the show's "monsters of the week."
Burma's got a few.
The etymological roots go to Sanskrit "Dhyan" -> Chinese "Chan" -> Japanese "Zen"
https://www.google.com/search?q=etymology+zen&ie=utf-8&oe=ut...
http://global.sotozen-net.or.jp/eng/library/glossary/individ...
Although there is good reason to speak of the "Zen school" as a distinct branch of the Buddhist tradition of Japan, there has never been any organized social or institutional entity bearing that name. At present, there are twenty-two comprehensive religious corporations (hōkatsu shūkyō hōjin 包括宗教法人) registered with the Japanese government that are recognized as belonging to the Zen tradition (Zenkei 禪系). These include: the Soto School (Sōtōshū 曹洞宗); fifteen separate corporations that identify themselves as branches (ha 派) of the Rinzai lineage (Rinzaishū 臨濟宗); the Ōbaku School (Ōbakushū 黃檗宗); and five small corporations that have splintered off from the Soto and Rinzai organizations. Each of the twenty-two Zen denominations has a number of temples affiliated with it, ranging from 14,664 in the Soto School to 3,389 in the Myōshinji branch of the Rinzai lineage (Rinzaishū Myōshinjiha 臨濟宗妙心寺派), 455 in the Ōbaku School, a few hundred in the smaller Rinzai denominations, and just a handful in the smallest of the corporations (all data from Bunkachō 文化廳, ed., Shūkyō nenkan 宗教年鑑, 2003 Edition).
One thing that clergy affiliated with all the Zen denominations in Japan hold in common is the belief in a Zen lineage (Zenshū 禪宗) of dharma transmission said to have been founded by the Buddha Shakamuni, established in China by the Indian monk Bodaidaruma, and subsequently transmitted to Japan by numerous Japanese and Chinese monks. During the Kamakura period (1185-1333) and the two decades immediately following, by one account, some twenty-four separate branches (ryūha 流派) of the Zen lineage were established in Japan. By another reckoning, there were forty–six individual transmissions of the Zen dharma to Japan, beginning with Myōan Eisai 明庵榮西 (1141-1215) in 1191 and extending down to the Chinese monks Ingen (C. Yinyuan 隱元,1592–1673) and Shinetsu (C. Xinyue 心越, 1639–1696), who came to Japan in 1654 and 1677, respectively, and established the so-called Ōbaku lineage (Ōbakushū 黃檗宗). At present, however, all Zen clergy trace their own lineages of dharma inheritance back to China through only two men: (1) Nanpo Jōmyō 南浦紹明 (1235-1308), a.k.a. Daiō Kokushi, founder of the Daiō branch (Daiōha 大應派) of Rinzai Zen; and (2) Dōgen Kigen 道元希玄 (1200-1253), founder of the Dōgen branch (Dōgenha 道元派) of Soto Zen. All the other branches of the Zen lineage that flourished in the past are said to have died out, having failed at some point to produce any more dharma heirs.
Most of the Zen denominations in Japan operate training monasteries in which the bureaucratic structures, ritual calendars, and modes of practice are modeled after those found in the leading Buddhist monasteries of Song (960-1279) and Yuan (1280-1368) dynasty China. Those institutional forms were first imported into Japan in the Kamakura period, chiefly (but not exclusively) by the same monks who transmitted the Zen lineage. Texts containing the religious lore of the Zen lineage in China - genealogies of dharma transmission, biographies of Zen masters, records of their discourses, and koan collections - were also brought to Japan at that time, and have been handed down to the present within the various denominations as the common heritage of the Zen school.
The key to this sort of trademark claim is likelihood of confusion or perhaps implied endorsement in having a common-sounding name. Where it is obvious that two companies are in entirely unrelated fields, then the holder of the mark who wants to shut others down had better have a very strong mark such that any use by others of something that sounds similar implies affiliation or endorsement.
There is no way that this is the case with the "zen" prefix.
Even on a personal level, I represented companies known as Zentek Strategy and Zentek Technology, the latter of which became a $2B market cap company before having issues in 2008. We filed and got a registered trademark for "Zentek" and held this from about 1990 through 2008 when the company had some problems and shut its operations. The mark that we registered was not even in Class 9 (where most tech companies file for marks) but in another class because there was already another long-established "zentek" company that held a registered mark in Class 9.
So, wow, the claimant here says, in effect, "we have been using 'zen' since 2007 and so we have a right to claim this exclusively as our own." And it then proceeds to file formal proceedings against all sort of other companies to force them to spend large sums of money or else give up using their marks that share only a common prefix.
Call it what you will. I call this abuse, pure and simple. I can only hope that the people doing this take pride in their coolness as zen proponents even as display the height of arrogance in how they choose to act.
http://www.csudh.edu/phenom_studies/mumonkan/mumonkan.htm If this is new to you, I recommend starting out with #29.
It just seems like they're so clearly the most well known "Zen" brand out there. And if this whole thing is about branding, then why not focus on the defensibility of the product rather than the name? Am I being naive here?
I actually think Pinterest is one of the greater names of recent. You can easily discern that the site is about "interests" and then when you learn about "pinning" items, the name becomes obvious.