HN Explorer

Ask HN: Are there companies that discourage working overtime?

10 points by tootall ↗ HN
In my 8 year professional career as a software developer I worked in a big corp, a late stage startup and a very early stage startup.

In all the teams I worked with I always found a good amount of members (senior and quite good at their craft) who constantly work overtime, by pushing code and sending emails at night and during weekends/holidays.

I have always been more than willing to work nights and weekends occasionally, and I reply to important emails from my phone when needed, but I am very efficient and focused in dealing with the tasks I am assigned to, so I am always able to finish everything on time with my 8-9 hours of work a day.

I don't feel that at the end of the day I'm getting rewarded less than the other members who always work overtime, because I consistently get excellent performance reviews and generous raises, but still it "selfishly" bothers me because this working overtime thing clashes with my ideal company culture, and it negatively affects for example junior developers, who are now pressured to work overtime as well. Heck, even if I'm quite senior and at the moment one of the most respected members of the team, I feel pressured as well sometimes. I've seen this consistently in all the 3 companies I mentioned above.

As a full disclosure, I know for sure that these people don't have significant equity in the businesses or big bonuses related to performance, it's just "what they do".

In my ideal world I would like a team of talented developers in a company culture that says: "You work overtime, it means you are either trying to play politics or inefficiently managing your time"

10 comments

[ 2.5 ms ] story [ 34.0 ms ] thread
Gustomaximus
I know exactly what you mean. So many companies have this culture. I really paid attention to this years back when I sat next to a great worker that would always be gone by 4pm. They came into the office and charged through things and didn't faff about on the unimportant. I saw the reality that prioritization is as important as hours. Problem is it's easier to judge someone on hours in office than output.

Anecdote aside, this is an example of VW trying to break this culture to make better workers: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-16314901

caseyf7
Another thing I discovered over the years is many people who work all the time are really trying to avoid people/things in their personal lives.
api
A lot of people who do this also sort of lie to themselves and others about how much they really work. They work a bit, goof off a bit, or work slowly or inefficiently.
rifung
I definitely haven't heard of any company that discourages overtime, and my experience has been very similar to yours.

On the other hand, I feel like saying "You work overtime, it means you are either trying to play politics or inefficiently managing your time" is a bit of a stretch. I've met coworkers who I genuinely believe just enjoy what they do at work.

It seems like an ideal would just be to make sure everyone knows they are not expected to work over time and nobody will hold it against them if they don't.

However, I do remember there was a company which had 4 day work weeks! I believe it was an education focused tech company in Oregon.

aaronchall
When I worked as a contractor at a large firm, it was very important to them that I worked no more than 40 hours a week. In fact, I could have been fired if I did. However, salaried employees may even be expected to show up before 9 and work to 7 or however much later it takes to get the job done.
thejteam
In the government contractor world overtime is often prohibited. By law, "you work it, you bill it."
skylark
Don't let it bother you. If you're performing at a high level, be confident in that instead of trying to tear others down.

Plenty of people code into the night because they just enjoy coding. Actively promoting a culture that puts a negative spin on that seems counterproductive.

warmfuzzykitten
I work at a company where you are expected to be able to get your work done in a five day, 40-hour work week. Everyone I know seems to work a little bit more than that, but not excessively and not at the office.
kfullert
Bytemark (an incredibly awesome UK hosting company) actively discourage working overtime and state it in their employment page https://www.bytemark.co.uk/company/employment/

DISCLAIMER I don't work for Bytemark, just been a customer for 10+ years and love the work they do and service they provide

GFischer
Well, I work in a company where the computer automatically shuts down at 6 p.m., and there is no outside email access for non-management.

It's not a software company. Software companies do tend to suffer from that kind of attitude.

However, it does suffer in the "talented developers" and technical challenges area.