Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

I've struggled with anxiety for as long as I can remember. I used to approached it with a fight or flight relationship. As I shifted my ways of identifying with it, I was able to turn that fight/hostility into a gentle dance. From there I was able to start taking the small steps that would help me have better control of it. Start now, or do I let it manifest further for my future self?

Here are some things that have helped me:

  - Meditation / mindfulness
  - Good sleep hygiene
  - Understanding and reading about the condition

There are many more, I'm sure you're aware of them.

I'd be happy to talk with you about it more. You ARE talented, don't let the mind get to you (it will try). All the best!

i can absolutely relate.

i have OCD, bipolar disorder, PTSD, and generalized anxiety disorder. i love writing software, but i struggle every. single. day. i totally understand the negative feedback loop. i worry that my performance will suffer, it DOES suffer because i worry so much about it, etc etc. and then there are days like today where i come in to work in the middle of a manic episode and have a million ideas that i can't extract from my brain because it's racing too fast. under less distressed circumstances, i could write something more eloquent for you, but getting just a few sentences out is a victory at the moment. suffice to say: you are not alone.

With respect, I often hear people say "I'm incredibly lucky."

When I think about the actions they have taken over time, it seems to me that they have had a history of generally good decision making.

So I just want to gently question whether your success is as much about luck as you may think.

Very much so, so much so we built technologies to help measure and manage the physiology of anxiety/stress. I found that my physiology is much more manageable when I sleep well and exercise. From the perspective of the body, the autonomic nervous system is stress/anxiety, sleep/relaxation, and exercise. They are all the same bodily, interconnected system. Meditation and naps and mindfulness exercises work. So does simple, calming breathing exercise. All are a skill like anything else.

I know I'll never change how I respond to social settings and large crowds, and both are intimately involved in my job as a founder, but the physiological and contextual data has helped me to realize that the effects are manageable. Those effects are often common and one reason alcohol is likely such a popular sedative. But alcohol affects how well I sleep and so I gave it up. Nothing is more important in my life now than getting a good night's sleep.

I'm a neuroscientist by training and was not taught much of anything about the physiology of fight-or-flight versus rest-and-relax during my Ph.D. It's an entire area of medicine untouched by modern science. If you saw the equivalent of a therapist in 1880, opium and cocaine were the Prozac and Ritalin of their time.

At work, we all actually joke openly about this and I think it helps to know that everybody feels that insecurity to some degree or other.

All week long you'll hear self-deprecating remarks like:

"Oops, I suppose that bug exposes me as the mediocre hack that I am, haha"

"...but unfortunately I forgot to uncomment that section, because I am a complete idiot..."

In a way it helps keep your confidence up, because you're modeling the behavior of confident people. (Joking openly about one's own shortcomings)

More to your question, have you looked into Internal Family Systems Therapy? I'm currently reading a book on this by Schwartz, and I'm finding it helpful.

http://www.amazon.com/Internal-Family-Systems-Therapy-Guilfo...

I curious as to what your diet consists of everyday?

I feel you. I have a wonderful family, well paid job I enjoy and am occasionally good at, he worry it's all going to be taken away.

I think there are a few practical things to do

- benchmark yourself against objective reality - understand the problem of imposter syndrome - improve your lifestyle - take medicines

Firstly, there are ways to discover your own knowledge and abilities against external benchmarks. For example many programmin languages have koans for practising or similar.

This will give you a way to sample your self more objectively.

Imposter syndrome - everyone has it, and everyone is afraid the rug will be pulled away. Absolutely everyone.

Sleep, eat exercise right. Easy to say, hard to do but every improvement will help you

Medicate - there are drugs from SSRIs onwards. Combined with plans like above there is little reason a years course would not help you buy time to sort the rest out.

Take care. You are not alone

Worrying about your competence to do the job more than your peers (who seem qualified to judge) is a good indication you're up to it. [1]

Self-confidence is higher amongst the ignorant, because they do not understand the size of the problem. A well-informed person knows nothing is as simple as it seems, so it's natural to worry. [2]

What will help you relax: be upfront to your team about what you don't know, or where you need help. The best trait a team member can have is self-knowledge.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

I know you said you're not seeking a therapeutic recommendation, but if you were my friend then I would buy you a beer and gently recommend seeing a therapist. I saw one for a year after I got divorced, and she was extremely helpful in teaching me how to get out of negative-feedback thought loops, which sounds like it might be useful for you, too. I was originally nervous about signing up for a lifetime of having someone be my emotional crutch. But my take on it now is: 1) Being a happy, fulfilled human is hard. 2) We are generally not good at it, and we don't have much time to get good at it. 3) If one person has a problem, ten million other people do too. 4) Many problems have genuine solutions, and those that don't almost always have approaches that are helpful.

It sounds like your anxiety is having a real negative impact on your life. If you had some physical ailment (say digestive issues or headaches) that were having such a negative impact, you would go to a doctor, yeah? It's the same deal.

Take care and good luck!

Find someone you trust that you can talk to, and talk it out. Preferably someone very even-keeled; it does no good if you talk to someone and they just freak out. Failing that, find a therapist, and talk it out.

Talk is humans' way of relieving anxiety. When you give voice to your fears and then find that other people think them nonsense (well, not nonsense, but fears, and not real problems to worry about), it tends to make them disappear in your own mind.

> Why am I writing this post? I'm seeking understanding, support, and related stories/situations. I'm not seeking a cure-all. I'm not seeking a pharmaceutical or therapeutic recommendation. Just support.

I know you didn't ask for this, but it needs to be said.

See a doctor. Get properly diagnosed. Get proper help. As someone who live with mental disorders, I can assure you, getting proper help is the best thing you can do.

> I have OCD

Is this diagnosed? I only ask because far too many people self-diagnose. You might be right, but you shouldn't self-diagnose. If you are diagnosed, follow up with your therapy, and share this information.

Get help.

I have anxiety disorder (it comes with depression too when I'm in the "phase"). I've been dealing with it by meds. And luckily, I have an awesome family & friends support. Those combination really helps. In addition to that, enough sleep is very important.

I'm still a junior developer and yes sometimes it's a hindrance but I'm always staying positive about it. I hope you do too.

Cheers.

I am in the same position. I am CTO of a startup in London. On paper, everything is wonderful. These past few months the company has quadrupled in size. We're in swanky offices. My commute is short - from the apartment that I own with my girlfriend who I love.

Anxiety is a constant demon hanging over me. I fell it every day. Not only that but feelings of deep self-loathing. Sometimes it paralyses me. I can't work for days on end, I can't face my colleagues. I go to the office, but am unproductive to the point of being entirely non-productive.

I make it up on other days, when I'm 'up'. But recently the periods of 'down' have been longer, harder, and seem unescapable. My up self is finding it harder to compensate.

I have to force myself to do the things I enjoy in my spare time. These days all I want to do when I get home is lose myself in pointless internet browsing. Imgur is a favourite - I'll swipe for hours through that dross.

I don't know where to go really. I've been in an ongoing battle with my mind since a severe bout of depression a few years ago. That unlocked a lot of stuff, and these days it's never as bad, but I'm aware of the fight every day, and it's exhausting.

I wish there was a way out, but there isn't. I'm going to be fighting this my entire life.

Used to be anxious, now I'm not. This stuff may or may not apply to you. Take it as one anecdotal experience.

First, are these in line?:

  * Sleep
  * Diet
  * Exercise
  * Meditation/relaxation time

Whenever I feel anxious now, I notice I've let one or more of those slide. Anxiety resolves when I fix them.

Second, I used to be anxious for the following reasons:

  * I was socially awkward with few friends.
  * I was bad at reading body language. 
  * I didn't have objective things I could point to that I had done that were unambiguously good.
  * My reasons for feeling good were all in one area.

Number 2 was a major cause of number 1. When I couldn't read people, I was always worried I'd do something wrong. This made me shy and awkward around people. This in turn made people less likely to want to hang around with me.

So I learned how to read body language. You don't have to live in fear of harsh reactions if you can read body language. You'll notice people broadcasting loudly "everything is fine, I think you're doing a good job" loud and clear. The odd occasions someone is displeased, you'll spot it a mile away. I can't emphasize this enough.

I used this to also fix any specific weaknesses that made me feel bad. So now I feel very comfortable with my life. I produced a bunch of stuff that everyone unambiguously agrees is good.

Finally, I made sure to put my efforts into a few areas. If work is going poorly this week, at least I lifted more at the gym, and vice-versa. Having your ego fulfilled from different areas prevents you from feeling bad if one goes south.

Hope that's useful.

Note: Advice of this calibre is all assuming that there's no issue that actually requires therapy/medication. I don't know much about those options. My experience was just garden variety anxiety that can affect any human being.

  1. Theory
  2. Trial and error
  3. Feedback
  4. Revision, repeat #2

Meditation. Put aside the Ego. Nobody thinks more about you than yourself. Exert discipline over the things you can, let go of the things you can not (Stoicism in a nutshell).

Hi this happened to me, I quit my prestigious job and got a much less prestigious job that is less stress. Now I want the stress back and am almost more anxious. If you have a lot to do just try and prioritize and do what you need to do today. That is what I always told myself. I had zero brain cycles and now I have lots but it's like I have nowhere to put them and would rather be getting juiced by that other better company. I will probably ask for my old job back at some point. :-) Much love! Everything in life is temporary and your heart knows best....

nb

I am diagnosed with Pure-O OCD and can relate to the constant fear. It's terrible and difficult to explain to someone. It sucks and sometimes I had to go home from work because the ruminating overwhelmed. I've had coworkers notice that I seem very distracted and take it personally until I tell them what's going on. The fears ranged from being an imposter to various other health concerns that weren't related to work in the least.

I'm currently seeing a psychiatrist and taking medication for my OCD and have explained my conditions to my higher ups so they would have a better understanding. I also started seeing a cognitive behavioral psychiatrist who had me doing exposure therapy to reduce my fear response to triggering stimuli. I've had significant improvements since i've started treatment, and now each day doesn't feel like the end of the world, but I still have moments of deep panic from time to time that are more manageable. I know you aren't seeking medical help which I completely respect, but I hope knowing that you aren't alone helps in some way.

+1 for diet, sleep, exercise, reading, and when those tools aren't available in your life, medication. A low dose can do wonders for clearing your head.

Sorry you're going through this. It's a rough ride, and recognizing the loop doesn't make it any easier to break.

You mention not wanting a "cure all" but just support. I'd like to offer you my hypothesis that this is part of your problem. You should be looking for a cure, not a palliative. And there is a cure, but it is a difficult one (and not without its rewards).

What's the cure? Others have mentioned meditation, and I second that. Meditation acts as a kind of "off" button for incessant thoughts that trigger each other. By letting concrete reality totally consume your awareness for even one instant, you squeeze out the self-reflective consciousness that is a key part of that loop, and weaken it. (Your body is a key part of this loop at two points: first as a source of "concrete reality" sensations, and second as a kind of residue of emotional reaction.)

Success on this path requires the ability to sit still and not get up even if you think of something better to do, or because you are bored, or because your butt hurts, or because you're anxious.

I felt that much of your narrative rings true with me as well. I found this book to be quite amazing and it gave me an interesting perspective on my thoughts: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0374533555/

> I'm not seeking a pharmaceutical or therapeutic recommendation.

Is that because you're already in therapy? If so, skip the following; if not why not seek out a good therapist who can guide you in CBT, or something similar. What you're describing is common, therapists have super good tools and strategies to help you with it. Therapy is no big deal; no different from having a personal trainer at the gym!

On the point of feeling like an imposter, or feeling afraid of looking stupid: there are a handful of people who I think of who are super smart and accomplished, and yet humble and gracious, and not afraid admit to not knowing something, etc.; trying to keep them in mind and emulate them has I think helped me with some of the issues you mention.

Take care. I'm sure you'll be able to find some strategies that work for you.

I have friends and family members that suffer anxiety ranging from minor to debilitating anxiety where they feel like they cannot function. As davidkim suggests below, meditation, sleep and even exercise can help alleviate some of the symptoms but you also have to know that anxiety/OCD can be caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain and you simply cannot wish it away. Medicine may be appropriate in your situation and so I would start with a consultation with your doctor. No one should suffer and miss out on the wonders of life.