Ask HN: Why USB drives are still using the FAT32 format?
With all the Terabyte of drives available for desktop machines and the affordable SSDs pushing toward the same limit, why is that every single USB stick (drive) out there is sold with the same FAT32 format? This is a hindrance as the max filesize on this format is 4Gig. So how come MSFT/APPL and Co have not agreed on a new file format to get past this out dated standard?
55 comments
[ 0.28 ms ] story [ 107 ms ] threadRecently discovered my TV was able to read ext4, never looked back :)
The only reason I ever use flash drives nowadays is to format an operating system.
Here's one of mine: When you want to transfer files between two machines which (for whatever reason) can't be on the same network, and you don't want to install additional software into the environment.
Depending on the files and the network involved, using a USB-stick (or any other physical media) can often be easier and faster than trying to find a network-bridge for your files.
In the case of my tv, it doesn't support wireless, and installing cables is out of the question.
There might be other ways, but honnestly I'm fine with copying bulk medias from to to time on a physical storage
Portable HDDs are bigger, more expensive, more fragile, and generally worse in every way (except transfer speeds) than USB flash drives for occasional short-haul data transfers. Writing 10G+ images onto a cheap 16G USB drive and throwing it across the office is a relatively common occurrence here.
"Who uses cable Ethernet these days" - I had to twice in the past year - a hotel in Germany that provided internet via a cable. And when the router decided to loose the WIFI password and I had to use an old laptop to physically connect.
I don't use USB sticks very often myself, but I am sure there are tons of scenarios where people find it useful. Just because it doesn't match any of your use cases is no justification.
As for your ethernet example, that's too bad. Wifi capabilities will get better for every year that passes, too.
I beg to differ. I've gone from 802.11g to n to ac and I've yet to see any noticeable gains bringing me even close to plain old Gigabit ethernet.
It cannot compete nor compare when it comes down to even individual aspects: reliability, individual throughput, total throughput (due to shared medium access), nor setup speeds.
I'm not just talking "a little bit slower". I'm talking 1 minute guaranteed to succeed (ethernet), vs 1 hour guaranteed to fail (wifi). In real world performance, it's orders of magnitudes slower. That's measurable. That's a fact.
For lots of use-cases wifi is utterly useless. Have fun trying to backup media to a iSCSI volume over wifi for instance.
I'm guessing you don't live in a heavily populated area where the wifi-bands are over-consumed and have little more effective BW than 25mbps to offer. The same crap I was promised would improve half a decade ago. It haven't.
A huge part of the tech-hungry power-users lives in these places and suffers through this subpar performance. We're not happy with mediocre wifi to cover our needs.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExFAT#Adoption
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExFAT#Restrictive_licensing_an...
That's part of the answer to the OP's question. I thought that ext2 might have caught on, but I guess vendors were scared off by the GPL and (later, when BSD licensed implementations became available) the lack of support on Windows.
Even if MSFT and AAPL and GOOG were to agree on a filesystem for future OS releases, it would take a very very long time until card manufacturers are willing to create drives that aren't FAT32.
Today's 5gb is tomorrow's word document.
I've got equipment with USB ports on it that can only read FAT32.
Transitions take time. Unfortunately both MSFT and APPL practice the fine art of "Don't improve your own product, hamper your competitors' efforts" as a way to maintain their respective kingdoms.
Windows XP had no problems reading NTFS.
If you mean "not made by the Linux kernel or GNU projects", that applies to much (most?) of the software available for Linux.
If you mean "proprietary", then NTFS-3G is GPL: http://www.tuxera.com/community/open-source-ntfs-3g/
Looks like exFat support has improved the last few years, so I bit the bullet, moved the data off and reformatted. Now working great on both OSs. I wish it were open sure, and I hear UDF is a possibility too, but stopped when it started working.
The main problem you have is that there is no udf partition id, so I've never had it mount on OSX systems I've had access to (I have none myself, and it seems to respect the partition id, unlike windows and linux).
This post seems like a good summary, http://tanguy.ortolo.eu/blog/article93/usb-udf. Though be warned that (from a quick read) some of the comments contain some misinformation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_file_systems#Sup...
and compare the number of green cells for each filesystem, specifically how "green" (ie compatible) it is.
It has been a nice little filesystem to use on thumbdrives where cross-platform compatibility is key.
The only downside is the sparse documentation on creating UDF filesystems on block devices.
Windows also assumes it's a disc, even though it does let you write if it's not XP.
Flash drives tend to be MLC or TLC NAND flash, which is slow and can sometimes be error-prone. Oftentimes manufacturers will perform a trick and have the start of the disk actually be faster SLC NAND. Then, as a further enhancement, they'll make sure the table falls on sector boundaries.
With a more complicated filesystem this becomes more of a challenge. But with FAT, it's easy.