Currently, a lot of states are considering banning sales of ivory. If you want to get involved, please consider contacting your representatives and voicing your support for these bans.
Over at /r/babyelephantgifs, we made a post which should explain everything that you need to know and which also includes a template that you can use when contacting your representatives
The situation is dire. At the current rate of poaching, elephants will be extinct in the next 10-15 years. Even though China is currently the biggest consumer of illegal ivory, the US is in second place.
You guys should also consider donating to the International Anti-Poaching Foundation[0][1] which fights the poachers. The founder, Damien Mander[2], is an Australian ex spec-ops sniper who is using his military experience to train the park rangers since they, unlike the poachers, tend to be poorly equipped and trained as well as understaffed.
There is also the David Sheldrick Wildlife Trust[3][4] which takes care of elephant and rhino orphans (most of whom are orphans due to poaching). For $50 a year, you can become a sponsor of a particular animal and they'll send you photos and updates about how your sponsored animal is doing. You can for example sponsor this little girl [5][6] who was rescued[7] just the other day. This sponsorship is a pretty great gift.
Is this even a problem in the states? Only I've ever seen is faux-ivory.
"The United States is the second-largest market globally for illegal wildlife products after China, and it still allows trade in ivory acquired before a worldwide ban in 1989."
c.) enforcement of these rules is costly and there isn't enough people to do it http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/overwh.... For example, the Fish and Wildlife service in New York has 6 employees which are supposed to be checking all cargo coming to NYC and NJ. That's very few people for the job.
A clearer way to send a message or take a stand is to be absolute. "No ivory sold here" is stronger and clearer than "Some ivory is fine, depending on how old it is"
If so, there have to be better ways to fight poaching.
Why not legalize it? Given how large the current black market is "farming" ivory has to be a viable enterprise at some level. Cows aren't going extinct anytime soon, why can't the same market force apply to elephants and rhinos?
> If so, there have to be better ways to fight poaching.
Better than banning the sales? How is legalizing it better? Because some people would be able to resell their old piano? You have a pretty dumb definition of better.
> Why not legalize it?
The current poaching epidemic is due to relaxation of CITES restriction of ivory trade in 2008 (I think). The poaching issues wasn't as bad until then. So "legalization" is what got us here in the first place.
> Given how large the current black market is "farming" ivory has to be a viable enterprise at some level.
Right, let's inflict pain and suffering on an entires species of extremely intelligent creatures so that we can keep making some shitty trinkets.
Besides the ethical issues, it's also unlikely to be viable economically. It takes a while for an elephant to grow tusks (as in decades).
> Cows aren't going extinct anytime soon, why can't the same market force apply to elephants and rhinos?
Domesticated cows might not, but their wild ancestors went extinct some 400 years ago (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurochs). What this would do is make the market for ivory even bigger and there wouldn't be anything preventing poachers from hunting wild elephants to extinction. If anything, it would make the extinction even faster.
You aren't the first person to suggest this idea but it's extremely stupid regardless. As in, I cannot understand how anyone would think that this is a better idea than banning sales of ivory.
At least looking at the California bill being considered: musical instruments would be exempted if they had documentation of being sufficiently old, and contained only a small amount of ivory.
Antiques over 100 years old would also be exempted, but only those containing less than 5% ivory by volume. This would seem to ban the sale of a wide variety of antiques and artworks. I'm not sure about the volumes, for example, but I expect it would ban the sale of many Georgian-era hair-on-ivory paintings and ivory portrait miniatures, amongst other things.
Usually there are exceptions for old pianos, but just as a thought experiment: imagine if you had to choose between selling your piano, and the extinction of elephants. Which would you choose?
We've stopped dealing in it, except for whatever was grandfathered in 20+ years ago.
Meanwhile, animal welfare in China is an absolutely nightmare with many rare and endangered animals ground down into "sex powder" or whatever superstitious nonsense still rules Chinese culture and Chinese "alternative" medicine, which is a very popular pseudo-science.
Its only recently that China outlawed things like tiger penis and rhino horn, but the damage has already been done. China is still very much behind the times. Also the statistic of 70% of Chinese not knowing where ivory comes from is a scary prospect as selling the concept of more animal rights to people ignorant of the basics of the animal trade will be an uphill battle.
The Daily Show had a segment on this a few months ago. IIRC there was a bill in Congress to stop the ivory trade in the US and it had wide support until the NRA spun it as an infringement of your gun rights, because you need to buy/sell/own ivory-handled pistols. Then it was predictably killed.
21 comments
[ 3.0 ms ] story [ 55.8 ms ] threadOver at /r/babyelephantgifs, we made a post which should explain everything that you need to know and which also includes a template that you can use when contacting your representatives
https://www.reddit.com/r/babyelephantgifs/comments/338f7t/co...
The situation is dire. At the current rate of poaching, elephants will be extinct in the next 10-15 years. Even though China is currently the biggest consumer of illegal ivory, the US is in second place.
You guys should also consider donating to the International Anti-Poaching Foundation[0][1] which fights the poachers. The founder, Damien Mander[2], is an Australian ex spec-ops sniper who is using his military experience to train the park rangers since they, unlike the poachers, tend to be poorly equipped and trained as well as understaffed.
There is also the David Sheldrick Wildlife Trust[3][4] which takes care of elephant and rhino orphans (most of whom are orphans due to poaching). For $50 a year, you can become a sponsor of a particular animal and they'll send you photos and updates about how your sponsored animal is doing. You can for example sponsor this little girl [5][6] who was rescued[7] just the other day. This sponsorship is a pretty great gift.
[0] http://www.iapf.org/en/
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Anti-Poaching_Fo...
[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damien_Mander
[3] http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org
[4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Sheldrick_Wildlife_Trust
[5] http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org/asp/orphan_profile.asp...
[6] https://instagram.com/p/3tgs8CgUJd/
[7] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHRosmdsoW0
"The United States is the second-largest market globally for illegal wildlife products after China, and it still allows trade in ivory acquired before a worldwide ban in 1989."
This doesn't seem like an issue to me.
How is it not an issue? Are you concerned about extinction of species?
This allows those who own ivory, potential many historical, to trade in those pieces.
How does this contribute to extinction? Unless there's time travel involved.
a.) sustains a market for ivory
b.) a lot of ivory has falsified paperwork
c.) enforcement of these rules is costly and there isn't enough people to do it http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/overwh.... For example, the Fish and Wildlife service in New York has 6 employees which are supposed to be checking all cargo coming to NYC and NJ. That's very few people for the job.
A centralized database just creates a lucrative side business for the sysadmins.
There are also lots of other endangered species, though the big mammals make the biggest news stories.
Why not legalize it? Given how large the current black market is "farming" ivory has to be a viable enterprise at some level. Cows aren't going extinct anytime soon, why can't the same market force apply to elephants and rhinos?
Better than banning the sales? How is legalizing it better? Because some people would be able to resell their old piano? You have a pretty dumb definition of better.
> Why not legalize it?
The current poaching epidemic is due to relaxation of CITES restriction of ivory trade in 2008 (I think). The poaching issues wasn't as bad until then. So "legalization" is what got us here in the first place.
> Given how large the current black market is "farming" ivory has to be a viable enterprise at some level.
Right, let's inflict pain and suffering on an entires species of extremely intelligent creatures so that we can keep making some shitty trinkets.
Besides the ethical issues, it's also unlikely to be viable economically. It takes a while for an elephant to grow tusks (as in decades).
> Cows aren't going extinct anytime soon, why can't the same market force apply to elephants and rhinos?
Domesticated cows might not, but their wild ancestors went extinct some 400 years ago (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurochs). What this would do is make the market for ivory even bigger and there wouldn't be anything preventing poachers from hunting wild elephants to extinction. If anything, it would make the extinction even faster.
You aren't the first person to suggest this idea but it's extremely stupid regardless. As in, I cannot understand how anyone would think that this is a better idea than banning sales of ivory.
Antiques over 100 years old would also be exempted, but only those containing less than 5% ivory by volume. This would seem to ban the sale of a wide variety of antiques and artworks. I'm not sure about the volumes, for example, but I expect it would ban the sale of many Georgian-era hair-on-ivory paintings and ivory portrait miniatures, amongst other things.
Meanwhile, animal welfare in China is an absolutely nightmare with many rare and endangered animals ground down into "sex powder" or whatever superstitious nonsense still rules Chinese culture and Chinese "alternative" medicine, which is a very popular pseudo-science.
Its only recently that China outlawed things like tiger penis and rhino horn, but the damage has already been done. China is still very much behind the times. Also the statistic of 70% of Chinese not knowing where ivory comes from is a scary prospect as selling the concept of more animal rights to people ignorant of the basics of the animal trade will be an uphill battle.
https://news.vice.com/article/china-outlaws-the-eating-of-ti...
http://money.cnn.com/2010/06/23/smallbusiness/world_cup_lion...