The same shorts that have attacked Overstock's CEO similarly attacked the CEO of Fairfax Financial:
"According to court documents, the hedge fund
companies allegedly retained an obscure operative named Spyro Contogouris to drive down Fairfax’s share price, a task he went about with alacrity. In 2005, he’s said to have
approached the company’s former CFO, claiming (falsely)that he’d been deputized by the FBI to obtain evidence of financial improprieties. He is thought to be the author of a
widely circulated 30-page letter that, among other things, compared Watsa to the convicted fraudster Martin Frankel. (It was even sent to the priest of Watsa’s church, St. Paul’s Anglican on Bloor.) In 2006, several false rumours began circulating: one claimed that the RCMP were pursuing Watsa; another said that they were about to raid Fairfax’s
office; yet another claimed he’d placed his assets in his wife’s name and fled the country. By then, the company’s stock had tumbled from highs in the $400 range to less than $100 a share."
Shorts are people that bet that a stock will fall. The process involves borrowing a share, selling them at their current high price, then buying them after they fall and giving the share back to who you borrowed it from.
Right, I created the account because it's not exactly popular to defend someone like Patrick Byrne (which proves my point since I was down-voted, even though I provided evidence of the kind of tactics that are used by certain short sellers... go figure)
I'm just saying that short sellers use tactics that are just as bad as what Byrne used here (I don't condone making a fake facebook profile, pretexting, etc).
But the fact is that in the Fairfax case, they engaged in a pretty complicated campaign aimed at driving down the stock. One of the method was to feed stories to journalists who specialize in "financial fraud".
Overstock already received $5M of settlement from Rocker Partners:
"Overstock.com (OSTK) this afternoon said that Rocker Partners, an investment firm now known as Cooper River Partners, will pay the company $5 million to settle long-standing litigation alleging that Rocker and others engaged in “libel, intentional interference with prospective economic advantage and violations of California’s unfair business practices act."
> "I created the account because it's not exactly popular to..."
by becoming anonymous you show that this isn't important. if something is important to you then all the more reason to stand behind it as yourself. your real-life karma is taking hits when you hide behind anonymity. man up.
You are (and I were) talking to a sock puppet. It's all well explained in the linked article and a couple more linked form there. Fascinating stuff, really.
Can someone explain exactly what's going on here between these guys? It all seems like a bunch of schizophrenic rambling.
I have no opinion on Overstock as an investment or business, but their market cap is around $300mm; I don't see how hedge funds could make enough shorting it for it to be worth committing fraud.
I can't give a good explanation of the financial aspects, but they've been trying to apply pressure to a bunch of journalists by publishing private information about them.
Patrick Byrne, the CEO of Overstock, has been on a crusade against naked short sellers, blaming a group of hedge funds for driving down his company's stock. He's been all but called a nutjob in the financial press, which has led him to criticize certain journalists as being in bed with the short-sellers.
The most recent episode concerned Deep Capture, a blog that supports Byrne. They were able to obtain the Facebook friends lists for the hedge fund managers and journalists targeted by Byrne and were able to show a large number of cross-links between the journalists and fund managers, and in some cases their families. Deep Capture was careful to avoid making specific charges, but the basic argument is that it establishes the possibility of collusion between the fund managers and an unprofessionally close personal relationship with the journalists.
You're going to believe a blog that considers "hacking into someones facebook account" to be friending them, getting accepted, and then writing down their friends. I couldn't stop laughing while reading this fallacious article. incoming downvotes
If the market tanks again, we can rise against the shortsellers for destroying the economy. As for now, this is paranoia and is ignorant of how markets operate.
15 comments
[ 2.7 ms ] story [ 49.8 ms ] threadThe same shorts that have attacked Overstock's CEO similarly attacked the CEO of Fairfax Financial:
"According to court documents, the hedge fund companies allegedly retained an obscure operative named Spyro Contogouris to drive down Fairfax’s share price, a task he went about with alacrity. In 2005, he’s said to have approached the company’s former CFO, claiming (falsely)that he’d been deputized by the FBI to obtain evidence of financial improprieties. He is thought to be the author of a widely circulated 30-page letter that, among other things, compared Watsa to the convicted fraudster Martin Frankel. (It was even sent to the priest of Watsa’s church, St. Paul’s Anglican on Bloor.) In 2006, several false rumours began circulating: one claimed that the RCMP were pursuing Watsa; another said that they were about to raid Fairfax’s office; yet another claimed he’d placed his assets in his wife’s name and fled the country. By then, the company’s stock had tumbled from highs in the $400 range to less than $100 a share."
full article: http://www.grahamanddoddsville.net/wordpress/Files/Gurus/Pre...
I'm just saying that short sellers use tactics that are just as bad as what Byrne used here (I don't condone making a fake facebook profile, pretexting, etc).
But the fact is that in the Fairfax case, they engaged in a pretty complicated campaign aimed at driving down the stock. One of the method was to feed stories to journalists who specialize in "financial fraud".
Overstock already received $5M of settlement from Rocker Partners: "Overstock.com (OSTK) this afternoon said that Rocker Partners, an investment firm now known as Cooper River Partners, will pay the company $5 million to settle long-standing litigation alleging that Rocker and others engaged in “libel, intentional interference with prospective economic advantage and violations of California’s unfair business practices act."
by becoming anonymous you show that this isn't important. if something is important to you then all the more reason to stand behind it as yourself. your real-life karma is taking hits when you hide behind anonymity. man up.
Here's an article that also outlines similar tactics: http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN2342166220091123
I have no opinion on Overstock as an investment or business, but their market cap is around $300mm; I don't see how hedge funds could make enough shorting it for it to be worth committing fraud.
http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2009/12/10/why-cant-i-...
http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2009/12/12/larry-bergm...
I can't give a good explanation of the financial aspects, but they've been trying to apply pressure to a bunch of journalists by publishing private information about them.
The most recent episode concerned Deep Capture, a blog that supports Byrne. They were able to obtain the Facebook friends lists for the hedge fund managers and journalists targeted by Byrne and were able to show a large number of cross-links between the journalists and fund managers, and in some cases their families. Deep Capture was careful to avoid making specific charges, but the basic argument is that it establishes the possibility of collusion between the fund managers and an unprofessionally close personal relationship with the journalists.
Further info: http://bit.ly/8M0Sj7 -- From The Big Picture (Ritholtz)