He is right wing ultra nationalist hindu fundamentalist leader. Accused of muslim genocide in 2002 which claimed more than 100 lives. Master in harnessing FUD tactics and social media. Friend of big corporates. He wasn't allowed to enter in US until he became prime minister. Doesn't believe in democracy. Anti-intellectual (many have been murdered).
He is nationalist leader if he was a fundamentalist then he must have done things representative of that in his 5 yrs in power. Like make India a Hindu nation
He is as accused as Obama is accused of killing thousands of Iraqis.
again if he doesn't believe in democracy, there must not have been elections in India after 2014, which is patently false.
So try again with why western media hates him and always paints democratic India in a negative light even in conflicts against dictators.
I am Indian. I am not aware of Obama policies but I am sure Obama wasn't directly responsible for any genocide in which Americans were murdered.
Modi is accused of genocide which 100s were brutally murdered in his own state where he was chief minister. Now if he is falsely accused is another matter but those accusations are grave and definitely have some basis.
Thousands of minorities are harassed on daily basis. Hundreds of intellectuals are threatened on daily basis. Some have even been murdered. I am on mobile but if you are really interested you can find thousands of stories of heinous deeds committed by his followers which are representative of his fundamentalism.
He is anti-democracy but that doesn't mean he can stop the process of election as per his wishes. It is just that he can't do much in that regard, given the democratic/power structure. Indira Gandhi was also autocratic in nature but she couldn't do much to harm the basic constitutional structure.
Western media hates Trump as well and it accuses Trump of undermining democracy and being racist. Whether western media is correct about Trump is subjective issue but you really can't treat those accusations as simple 'either -or' issues. Truth must be somewhere in between.
Modi was falsely accused as is evident in Supreme court acquiting the frivolus argument and his election to PM of the largest democracy in the world.
so it is a red herring to keep bringing it up.
I am a minority NRI and can state clearly that no harassment as you state happens. None of my kith and kin have reported any such incidents on the ground.
Unless you can state proof for the anti-democracy claim, it is clearly baseless. With proof you have him praising Putin and Xi and wondering if that is possible in USA. Nothing even remotely similar for Modi, so what gives?
I thought I'd have to compile a list, but HT did it for me. I don't consider their journalism of high quality, but even they can compile a list of rationalists, intellectuals, journalists and others who have been murdered.
Personal attacks are not allowed here. Would you mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the spirit of this site to heart? That means respecting others, regardless of how wrong they are or of how strongly you disagree.
Now twice you guys have said something about "false information" when you are the ones misunderstanding and lying.
It is literally true that muslims are being banned in America. The thread you are responding to said:
> I don't know Indian politics
> Right now Muslims aren't allowed to enter our country.
That was an American, talking about America. The reason the original person brought this up was because the GP insinuated not trusting Modi because he was banned from entering the US. Currently, certain muslims are banned from entering the US, so it's not a significant measure of credibility.
Read through what I've written in the context of the discussion I've had. Then read what you've written. I'd rather have said what I've said than what you've said.
has been exposed as a furphy time and again. The claim deliberately ignores trigger for the riots to mischaracterise the events as a planned one. The immense anger was caused by the burning of a train compartment of Hindu pilgrims by local Muslims who blocked the exits and set fire to the train.
> Master in harnessing FUD tactics and social media:
what is this, you are accusing him of using the tech tools at everyones disposal competently and extrapoloate it to FUD tactics
> Friend of big corporates
Making sure businesses have a better environment to function is now bad. Cutting down red tape is now helping corporates?
> Doesn't believe in democracy:
so a murder is one state that he isn't in control of is pinned on him as anti-democratic. This in a country of 1300 million people.
looking at the progress in the investigation and the freedom to highlight the case shows democracy is alive and thriving.
The pogroms in Gujarat in 2002 killed over 1000 people. And one should also add that the BJP's embrace of Hindu chauvinism has caused repeated episodes of lynching throughout the country (as a somewhat relatable phenomenon for Western, there are surely many more events since 2014 that have damaged our country's claim to secular government.)
Not at all. He actually provided millions of toilets, thousands of kilometres of road and rail, electrified almost all India, help opened bank account with insurance to all Indians, and many things more. This groundwork will make him win the election. This air strike is just "sone pe suhaga".
This. This is a problem with lot of Indians these days. They can't digest someone can genuinely appreciate positive side of modi or the current government. No one is perfect. Supreme court did not convict modi for 2002. Respect the judiciary.
I work in Power sector in India. The claim he electrified all the villages is pure lie and publicity gimmick.
Much of Rural electrification work was done under RGGVY scheme (Congress) . Only minor and finishing part was completed under DDUGJY (BJP).
Also, his original claim was 100% electrification. I have worked in Ladakh region of JK state which is most inaccessible and backward area and I can tell you that there are many areas in Ladakh which are still unelectrified.
It depends. Though power supply is a crisis in India, no government ever came into power or lost power because of it.
Most of his supporters are ultra-nationalists/anti-muslims/anti congress. You can guess only power issue isn't going to decide the voting preference. There are many issues at play. Infrastructure is the least important of them.
Neither he, nor me, claimed 100 percent electrification. Second, electrification is not only wiring to endpoint but also production and distribution capacity improvement, which actually happened in his regime.
No its not. Population is it's biggest strength...if India educates it's young people, invests in clean energy and brings about meaningful social change instead of stirring up nationalistic fervour..this century will be the century on India.
Unfortunately the first is a big if. The people who are having 4, 5, 6 kids or more are not interested in getting them educated. This only perpetuates the cycle of illiteracy and poverty.
He is at the core a hindu fundamentalist, and the fastest India can get over him and his party, the faster India can transition to a fully westernized liberal society and government.
He runs his government like a PR machine for himself, while reform and progress has all but stalled under his watch. Free speech and Free press are under threat in India now.
The day in which McDonald's can sell their big Mac in India is farther now, than ever.
For all its good points, I find Indian constitution a weak document, insufficiently protecting the citizens from abuse of power by the government. The federal structure is half formed, states not having enough freedom to pursue policy.
The tort law has not yet been codified, civil law is weak, forcing most matters to be adjudicated through criminal law, which is bad for plaintiffs. Most ills of India n life like poor regard for people's safety and well-being can be traced to the lack of a tort law, yet nothing has been done for it by the government.The similary lack of effective recourse to class-action litigation.
In addition to all that, problems in Kashmir appears no nearer to solution, rather it has deteriorated. Only way any progress can be made looks to be comprehensive negotiations with all stake holders, yet this Government has never shown willingness to do so and has even shutdown the elected legislative of that state.
> the fastest India can get over him and his party, the faster India can transition to a fully westernized society and government.
Wow. This reads like a call for cultural genocide, and reeks of white supremacist undertones. Having a “western” society is not likely the goal of Indian society, and nor should it be. Why is that the benchmark? I am not even sure that’s the right thing for us.
Please don't jump straight to extreme political labeling. Even if someone said something questionable, responding like this leaves nowhere to go except flamewar. This is one reason we have this guideline:
Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.
Few weeks ago, I was transiting through Delhi to Astana. Flight got cancelled, I got stuck in Delhi, and was told to GTFO out of the country till the end the day or be sent to immigration jail.
Had to buy a last minute ticket to Dubai for cash at the counter for 1k :(
I was able to find, with some quick googling, lots of evidence that Modi’s government is generally functional and has a fair list of achievements. Frankly this makes me think the Indian political system is more functional than we have been led to believe:
https://www.quora.com/What-has-the-Modi-government-achieved-...
Coverage of Modi in our media, focusing on him being painted as a “nationalist”, immediately raises red flags for me. Why is it strange that someone in a different country would want to defend their culture against Western influence, especially after the history of colonization?
Well I don't have any evidence either way, but between a Quora answer and what you've written, I have to imagine the Quora answer has more information.
Telling someone else to produce more significant evidence for you isn't the best way to convince people that what you're saying is true.
You're speaking as though quora is the only source of information on this when the very premise of the OP was that it's an alternative to the entirety of news. And you also imply that the parent post was somehow presenting itself as an alternative to quora, when they were quite clearly saying they simply wouldn't trust quora, which seems like a reasonable position. It sounds like maybe you took something about it personally.
> You're speaking as though quora is the only source of information on this
I claimed that the Quora thread probably had more information than a comment complaining about the quality of the thread.
> It sounds like maybe you took something about it personally.
I take everything personally. Your words are showing up in front of people. If the things you're saying are wrong it creates a negative externality for the world around you.
All: this thread went deep into flamewar hell. We ban accounts that post like this repeatedly, as you'll see if you look through the bowels of this thread, not that I recommend it.
If you can't remain strictly respectful in your comments here, regardless of how wrong another comment is or how strongly you feel, then please don't post.
The entire submission was off-topic to begin with. We don't want garden-variety politics, horse-race takes, or flamewar fodder on Hacker News. None of that gratifies intellectual curiosity, the purpose of the site.
60 comments
[ 3.3 ms ] story [ 118 ms ] threadHe is as accused as Obama is accused of killing thousands of Iraqis.
again if he doesn't believe in democracy, there must not have been elections in India after 2014, which is patently false.
So try again with why western media hates him and always paints democratic India in a negative light even in conflicts against dictators.
Modi is accused of genocide which 100s were brutally murdered in his own state where he was chief minister. Now if he is falsely accused is another matter but those accusations are grave and definitely have some basis.
Thousands of minorities are harassed on daily basis. Hundreds of intellectuals are threatened on daily basis. Some have even been murdered. I am on mobile but if you are really interested you can find thousands of stories of heinous deeds committed by his followers which are representative of his fundamentalism.
He is anti-democracy but that doesn't mean he can stop the process of election as per his wishes. It is just that he can't do much in that regard, given the democratic/power structure. Indira Gandhi was also autocratic in nature but she couldn't do much to harm the basic constitutional structure.
Western media hates Trump as well and it accuses Trump of undermining democracy and being racist. Whether western media is correct about Trump is subjective issue but you really can't treat those accusations as simple 'either -or' issues. Truth must be somewhere in between.
so it is a red herring to keep bringing it up.
I am a minority NRI and can state clearly that no harassment as you state happens. None of my kith and kin have reported any such incidents on the ground.
Unless you can state proof for the anti-democracy claim, it is clearly baseless. With proof you have him praising Putin and Xi and wondering if that is possible in USA. Nothing even remotely similar for Modi, so what gives?
I thought I'd have to compile a list, but HT did it for me. I don't consider their journalism of high quality, but even they can compile a list of rationalists, intellectuals, journalists and others who have been murdered.
I wouldn't judge someone based on whether or not they are allowed to enter my country. I would say judging that way would be anti-intellectual.
It is not false information.
[1] https://www.aclu-wa.org/pages/timeline-muslim-ban
The link you provided gives a timeline for Trump’s ban on immigrants in USA.
Kindly go through the context properly, coz your statements create confusion and propagate false information.
It is literally true that muslims are being banned in America. The thread you are responding to said:
> I don't know Indian politics
> Right now Muslims aren't allowed to enter our country.
That was an American, talking about America. The reason the original person brought this up was because the GP insinuated not trusting Modi because he was banned from entering the US. Currently, certain muslims are banned from entering the US, so it's not a significant measure of credibility.
Nowhere has he said - > I don't know Indian politics
Neither did he say he was talking about America, nor that he’s an American
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19412954
Read through what I've written in the context of the discussion I've had. Then read what you've written. I'd rather have said what I've said than what you've said.
If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
I have sent an email. Kindly go through it.
In the email, I have requested you to give me a chance. I realize this thread lost its plot. Never shall I post anything related to politics again.
I have also gone through the guidelines carefully once again, and shall follow it to the letter.
Thanks.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
Citations:
Accused of muslim genocide in 2002:
1. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Gujarat_riots#Allegatio...
Master in harnessing FUD tactics and social media:
1. https://www.reddit.com/r/india/comments/2edcpc/double_facepa...
2. https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/bjp-plans-a-whatsa...
3. https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/bjp-social-media-cell-...
4. https://www.altnews.in/hindu-khatre-mein-hai-how-the-fake-ne...
5. https://www.reddit.com/r/india/comments/3727an/how_does_bjp_...
Friend of big corporates:
1. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/patna/JDU-RJD-deman...
2. https://indianexpress.com/article/india/rafale-deal-reliance...
3. https://rightlog.in/2016/11/reliance-jio-black-money-ambani-...
4. https://thewire.in/media/cobrapost-expose-top-paytm-official...
Doesn't believe in democracy:
1. https://indianexpress.com/article/india/gauri-lankesh-murder...
2. https://www.reddit.com/r/india/comments/84bmwx/death_of_demo...
3. https://www.reddit.com/r/india/comments/8kjq10/karnataka_ele...
4. https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/06/04/modis-full-court-pr...
has been exposed as a furphy time and again. The claim deliberately ignores trigger for the riots to mischaracterise the events as a planned one. The immense anger was caused by the burning of a train compartment of Hindu pilgrims by local Muslims who blocked the exits and set fire to the train.
> Master in harnessing FUD tactics and social media:
what is this, you are accusing him of using the tech tools at everyones disposal competently and extrapoloate it to FUD tactics
> Friend of big corporates
Making sure businesses have a better environment to function is now bad. Cutting down red tape is now helping corporates?
> Doesn't believe in democracy:
so a murder is one state that he isn't in control of is pinned on him as anti-democratic. This in a country of 1300 million people.
looking at the progress in the investigation and the freedom to highlight the case shows democracy is alive and thriving.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cow_vigilante_violence_in_In...
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
Much of Rural electrification work was done under RGGVY scheme (Congress) . Only minor and finishing part was completed under DDUGJY (BJP).
Also, his original claim was 100% electrification. I have worked in Ladakh region of JK state which is most inaccessible and backward area and I can tell you that there are many areas in Ladakh which are still unelectrified.
Most of his supporters are ultra-nationalists/anti-muslims/anti congress. You can guess only power issue isn't going to decide the voting preference. There are many issues at play. Infrastructure is the least important of them.
Indian people have become tired of ignoring the 1000 cuts policy of Pakistan and appreciated a PM willing to call Pakitan's N bluff.
He runs his government like a PR machine for himself, while reform and progress has all but stalled under his watch. Free speech and Free press are under threat in India now.
The day in which McDonald's can sell their big Mac in India is farther now, than ever.
For all its good points, I find Indian constitution a weak document, insufficiently protecting the citizens from abuse of power by the government. The federal structure is half formed, states not having enough freedom to pursue policy.
The tort law has not yet been codified, civil law is weak, forcing most matters to be adjudicated through criminal law, which is bad for plaintiffs. Most ills of India n life like poor regard for people's safety and well-being can be traced to the lack of a tort law, yet nothing has been done for it by the government.The similary lack of effective recourse to class-action litigation.
In addition to all that, problems in Kashmir appears no nearer to solution, rather it has deteriorated. Only way any progress can be made looks to be comprehensive negotiations with all stake holders, yet this Government has never shown willingness to do so and has even shutdown the elected legislative of that state.
Wow. This reads like a call for cultural genocide, and reeks of white supremacist undertones. Having a “western” society is not likely the goal of Indian society, and nor should it be. Why is that the benchmark? I am not even sure that’s the right thing for us.
Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
Few weeks ago, I was transiting through Delhi to Astana. Flight got cancelled, I got stuck in Delhi, and was told to GTFO out of the country till the end the day or be sent to immigration jail.
Had to buy a last minute ticket to Dubai for cash at the counter for 1k :(
If that’s the case, any country would do the same.
Last time I got stuck in Qatar, I was given a gift card, and hotel stay paid by an airline. A very different experience.
May I ask if the country whose citizen you are shows flexibility?
And for my own country, Russia, nope. It is just few steps away from becoming North Korea now...
Coverage of Modi in our media, focusing on him being painted as a “nationalist”, immediately raises red flags for me. Why is it strange that someone in a different country would want to defend their culture against Western influence, especially after the history of colonization?
Telling someone else to produce more significant evidence for you isn't the best way to convince people that what you're saying is true.
I claimed that the Quora thread probably had more information than a comment complaining about the quality of the thread.
> It sounds like maybe you took something about it personally.
I take everything personally. Your words are showing up in front of people. If the things you're saying are wrong it creates a negative externality for the world around you.
If you can't remain strictly respectful in your comments here, regardless of how wrong another comment is or how strongly you feel, then please don't post.
The entire submission was off-topic to begin with. We don't want garden-variety politics, horse-race takes, or flamewar fodder on Hacker News. None of that gratifies intellectual curiosity, the purpose of the site.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html