when i worked in a workplace i always assumed they didnt but thankfully my skills are good enough that it doesnt get me kicked out. i can gel with a few people but its pretty rare.
does it matter to me? nope but im autistic so its not really a strange situation for me, i generally assume people only speak to me if they need something, on the rare occasions where they dont i start wondering what sort of ulterior motive they have, which is probably why i dont really have friends save for a few people ive known decades
My stupid questions and comments make people laugh sometimes, so I assume they do, but I would never want to know peoples truest thoughts about me anyway.
In the end, you're just another person in their life, just like they are another person in yours, so it doesn't matter as much as you think...
I think so. I get worried I ask too many questions some time (newest hire of a small team of vets) but we have a lot of good conversations and learn from one another, aside from friendly chats and making one another laugh from time to time.
Humor is always good, really it just comes down to recognizing your surroundings and acting accordingly.
Old guy here who understands what you're getting at.
My thoughts on how you do it:
1. Be a genuinely good person.
2. Be a team player. Always credit the team. People will figure things out.
3. Do small, nice things for people without the expectation of reciprocation. They shouldn't require a major time or money investment from you. Just little things.
4. Show up on time. Don't be the first to leave.
5. Don't overwork. Overworking leads to negative effects on your health.
Not necessarily - if things need to be done, don't leave people to it just because you're done; try to be helpful (of course don't let others take advantage). The same way - don't stay over time if given thing can be continued next day; work is work, and while it is important, there are more important things
4 basically means don't be that guy who does as little work as contractually obligated to.
There was actually one situation where I was the last to come and first to leave. I'm pretty sure I was well disliked at that company even though I more than did my share. You're just not seen as part of the group.
I totally agree with this. This culture of being expected to be present at work simply to pretend like you're working more needs to end immediately in every work place. It's just plain toxic.
Only if 100% of your co-workers over-work, arrive early and stay late. I’ve worked in companies of wildly varying sizes, from 2 (startup) to 200,000 (megacorp), some of them full of very hard workers, and it has always been easy to not be first out by just meeting the minimum time obligation that I agreed to. There are usually some people working less, and the advice above was just to not be one of them, rather than kill yourself by working harder than everyone.
For some reason, I assumed 4th to be about meetings (don't make others wait, don't leave in awkward demeanour). Probably I am attending too many meetings.
When I was in 6th grade, I went on a field trip, and the teacher handed out awards to all the kids for what they did on the trip. Most of the kids got things like "most athletic" and "best teamwork skills" and "best singing voice" and things like that. Mine was "muddiest person" or something like that because I had slipped and fallen in the mud one day. Even back then, I felt like it was mildly insulting.
In my career, the "awards" I get are kind of similar. I get the "Funniest Slack GIFS" awards where everyone else gets praise for releasing good features and fixing the most bugs and giving the best presentation. I do those things very well too, but somehow the public perception of me is that I'm a klutz or a goofball, even though I try to be serious and professional.
It's kind of frustrating. So to answer your question, no, I don't think that people like me and enjoy my presence. And I don't know how to be better.
I can be quite the oddball, colourful to put it mildly - in both "good" and "less then stellar" ways.
But I never really knew how people I work with perceive me, beyond the coworkers I was really close with. I figured they mostly saw me as some sort of weirdo that they tolerate at best.
Then one day, I left a job and went back to the same company a few weeks later. On day 1 of my come back, within the first 5 minutes of doing a mock welcome - I already knew everyone in this new team, another lad came behind me and lifted me up, in a celebratory fashion.
It was really unexpected but it's one of my fondest memory. This took place in small satellite office with an overall great vibe, so YMMV.
But all in all, I don't think there's anything wrong with being recognized for the morale boost you might provide to your surroundings.
The fact that people are openly praising you for acts that perhaps seem futile or downright insulting to you is a good sign. It means that you're approachable and able to handle a joke or two with no hard feelings. It can be an advantage if you learn how to leverage it.
I try to use emoji as little as possible myself, but one thing that I find genuinely useful are emoji reactions, because they don't generate notifications. When someone writes "I'm gonna $do_thing if that's okay with you", I can send a :thumbsup: reaction and they won't be disturbed by the notification, yet they can immediately see if I answered. Or when someone has a baby and posts the obligatory image to the team channel, people can pile up those reactions without my phone going pling-pling-pling-pling.
(To be fair, the same can be said about threads, but in my experience, people are way more consistent about using emoji reactions than they are about properly threading their conversations.)
Thank you for sharing this nice snippet from your life.
I can quote my experience from 3rd grade here. After being an average student for first 2 years, I came first in my third grade with 73%. I was proud and shared the report card to my father. Unfortunately, at the same time, a girl from neighbor also showed her report card to dad and he saw her 96%. He looked at me with a sigh in his eyes and said its good but it is not anyway near to 96%.
I was literally pissed, that I worked my ass off, and my father doesn't care that I am first as well in my class. He cared about the difference in percentage. So, I decided not to give a damn about my father's approval and till now I still give a damn about it, as he always comes out with some really high bar.
I recently have learned the Mantra to compare oneself today with oneself yesterday, or the week before, or a month before, or a year before. You can always find a balance of good and bad with the passage of time.
Think of it as an opportunity to see how effectively you're promoting your work. Are you just letting your work speak for itself? Environment depending, you could benefit from a strategy for [shameless] self promotion.
Think about this is way -- if others don't have no other marketable skill other than coding, it makes sense that your off-beat skills are recognized and the coding skill award goes to your co-worker -- otherwise you might end up hogging all the awards :-). I think someone awarded "funniest slack gifs" would be a beloved person of the group.
I often find myself at the other side of this situation, when people compliment my work (which is rather ordinary) because i do not do anything else of note.
Do people come directly to you for information on your area of expertise? For me it seems they haven't done as much than I'd expect, but I can't say for sure if that's because they don't like me or because my expertise is less respected than I imagine it should be. Either way it does matter to my career prospects as well as to my feelings.
I am not very social generally, but this goes away after you've been around people for long enough. What I am is very courteous and respectful. I generally help people as much as I possibly can, I only provide suggestions instead of acting like I necessarily know better. I give props to people and recognise when they're doing good work.
People generally seem to like working with me, and I could easily consider a lot of my current and past co-workers good friends.
Turn the question around and ask the same thing about your coworkers. Now take the average of your opinions about all your coworkers. That's likely how people view you. The truth probably is that other people just don't think of you all that much, so I wouldn't worry about it. As long as you avoid the bottom 10% such that you don't stick out, then it's all good. And frankly if you are asking this question, you probably aren't.
I'm almost certainly not the person my co-workers would choose to be friends with or go out of their way to have present when not at work. I'm totally cool with that. The feeling is mutual.
But I'm also fairly certain that (while even our best friends always have some habits we find irritating) for the most part they find me pleasant enough to be around and interact with.
It matters to me that my colleagues find me pleasant and easy to work with, friendly, and not grating. It doesn't matter much to me whether they particularly like me as a person as long as our interpersonal relationship is good enough to effectively facilitate our professional relationship.
On the other hand, if I find you frustrating to work with on a professional level, it doesn't matter how pleasant you are to have a beer with. I'm going to resent you and wish we didn't have to work together.
This line of thinking can be detrimental to your mental health. Since you’re posting on Hacker News I’m assuming you’re not in politics — possibly the only career where likability matters.
Just make sure to keep your boss happy, and keep your coworkers and/or reports from literally hating you and you’re fine.
Trying to do anything more than that could lead you to developing social anxiety. There’s no way to truly understand what’s in someone else’s mind, so unless someone comes to you with a specific, actionable complaint don’t worry too much about what they think of you.
Listening and genuinely caring about others goes a long way. Honestly though, you have zero control about what others think of you. If you do good work, and are kind, compassionate and respectful I wouldn't worry about it. If you feel you have some specific deficit there are certainly professionals you can pay to help you fix it.
Yes, I'm even close friends with a few. You know like you know in any other context. People usually tell you and show you. I've made many friends at work over the years.
The thing is, you have to care about people for them to like you. Be genuine with them, be there for them and don't be a dick. Have integrity. Allow them to know that you're a human being that makes mistakes, that you're imperfect and that's fine and you're comfortable with that in you (and others).
Ask for help when you need it, and offer it when you have it. Specially around things people really care about.
Also, and this is the hard part, work on yourself, on your self-esteem, on being better at dealing with your own emotional state. This transfer to others too and makes all the other stuff come easier.
A few years ago, the company I worked at was switching from offices to an 'open floor plan', and the noise and anxiety dropped my productivity to near zero, so I tendered my resignation. It was the longest I'd ever held a job (and still is), so I didn't enjoy leaving, but I had no choice.
My coworkers held a little going-away party for me, and gave me a custom trophy they'd had made with my (IRC) name on it -- just for being me.
So I feel confident in saying that, back when I worked in software, my coworkers enjoyed my presence, and management put up with me.
Likes/Dislikes, unlike facebook clicks, are very personal and they vary with interactions, communications and level of trust in between you and your colleagues.
I would like to recommend this small exercise based on the game theory called "Evolution of Trust", https://ncase.me/trust/
At the end of this exercise there were three findings:
1. Repeat Interactions
2. Look for a possible win-win situation
3. Low Miscommunication
Definitely, as I said in the start, there is a lot more than a few factors that affect a colleague likeness/dislikeness towards you. The biggest lesson from above exercise in response to your questions would be:
"In the short term, your environment defines how people like you, but in the long term, it is you who defines the environment. So, do what you can do to improve conditions necessary to evolve trust, build relationships, communicate clearly."
If it is important that you want people to like you, then communicate clearly.
Ask them, "Have you ever thought, Why do you think any colleague should like you?". Tell them, what are the reasons you like them professionally and personally, and ask the favor back.
I do it every time whenever I have a question of like/dislike related to a colleague.
idgaf :) I try to be polite, be a good team member, and keep personal distance. My coworkers shouldn't have much information to (dis)like me or have much personal idea about me. I don't want to be a full person with them - we're professionals. Works well.
It can be pretty hard to know whether work friendships are genuine. It’s worth assessing what you want, and whether it actually matters to you. It’s much easier to get what you want when you know what it is.
Also turn the question around and ask yourself whether you care about others at work, and whether you like them and enjoy them. Are you letting them know in verbal or non-verbal ways? How often are you putting yourself in a place to be judged? For example, do you invite coworkers to your place for drinks/dinner/games? Some indicator might be whether people will do things with you outside of work, if you want that.
Work relationships, like school, usually are happenstance. You’re all employees making a living and the company controls making a living. It should be expected that some work friendships are a matter of employment or situational convenience and not deep lasting bonds.
Personally, I do feel somewhat liked at work, but it’s starting to matter less to me. I do usually try to be likable and also contribute, and those things do help. They way I actually know whether people liked me usually comes much later, often after I’ve left the company. The way I know is by finding who’s interested in catching up with me on social media, or getting together to hang out or reminisce, or even start a new side project.
Seeking out some people with shared interests outside of work can help. At one company, I started a mountain biking club, and made some friends by welcoming newcomers and helping people learn how to ride.
It has in the past felt like more people liked me when I’ve been a manager. That also fades faster and becomes apparent that it’s more often ‘purely by interest’ as you put it.
No, people at work don't like me, and they don't enjoy my presence, but that's okay. I act professionally, I do my best to make good technical decisions, and I assist others when asked for help. I'm generous with my time. I receive positive peer & manager reviews, but when all is said and done only one thing matters: no one keeps in touch with me after work ceases to be the shared medium within which communications usually take place.
It's difficult to estimate how many people I've worked with. I've built good rapport with dozens of individuals throughout the years, but I'm still in touch with only one person.
This doesn't bother me, as my personality has nothing to do with work. My opinions, to which I'm entitled, are equally upsetting to both sides of the political divide. I don't take part in office parties, and I'll never join my colleagues on a company-sponsored beach retreat. My personality is my own, and liking me isn't a prerequisite to working productively together towards shared goals.
All this is to say: work isn't life, and life isn't work.
Yes, I receive praise and promotion even though I feel like i don't actually ship anything. I can only deduce that people like me and so they speak well of me.
Off topic, but I believe this thread was posted a few days ago but has reappeared as new (currently says 4 hours ago) after a delay. OP originally posted it two days ago, visible from their submissions page. I noticed this happen a few days ago as well.
I've had jobs where I was told I was well liked and people stopped by to have conversations with me every day.
I've also had jobs where my name brought with it a reputation for expecting results and answers without hearing the life story behind it. It was best to e-mail me for a quick reply and if you see headphones on, don't wave in my face.
At my last job, I finally ended up working at a company with around 150 employees on-site.
I set a few ground rules for myself before joining:
No social media interactions with people from work. Invitations can be deferred until after you no longer work together. Don't get suckered into talking about politics or other divisive topics. Keep it professional and always do the right thing.
With that in mind, to answer your questions:
Did people like me?
Heck yes they did! It was easy! I'd walk right up and introduce myself to everyone I didn't know whenever the opportunity presented itself. I'd learn about them as much as I could and tell them about what I did and hopefully we'd be able to help each other. I'd ask people how things were going and try to hang out with people as much as I could during lunch / coffee breaks.
But more importantly, did they respect me?
It was clear to everyone why I was there. I was there to make my team succeed despite everything that was going on outside my team. This meant that there was plenty of work to be done beyond what my title suggested.
I think at my former work place people were somewhat confused about me.
I am Deaf and they sometimes didn't know what to do with me. I lipread but have difficulties in meetings. I also avoided joining social gatherings, for example coffee breaks, because lipreading is, well, exhausting. Still, I delivered code and the company was satisfied with my work, and sometimes they were surprised about that.
So people perhaps tried to like me and enjoy my presence, but probably felt unconfortable instead pitying me and asking themselves how they would manage if they were Deaf.
56 comments
[ 2.7 ms ] story [ 111 ms ] threaddoes it matter to me? nope but im autistic so its not really a strange situation for me, i generally assume people only speak to me if they need something, on the rare occasions where they dont i start wondering what sort of ulterior motive they have, which is probably why i dont really have friends save for a few people ive known decades
In the end, you're just another person in their life, just like they are another person in yours, so it doesn't matter as much as you think...
Humor is always good, really it just comes down to recognizing your surroundings and acting accordingly.
My thoughts on how you do it:
1. Be a genuinely good person.
2. Be a team player. Always credit the team. People will figure things out.
3. Do small, nice things for people without the expectation of reciprocation. They shouldn't require a major time or money investment from you. Just little things.
4. Show up on time. Don't be the first to leave.
5. Don't overwork. Overworking leads to negative effects on your health.
There was actually one situation where I was the last to come and first to leave. I'm pretty sure I was well disliked at that company even though I more than did my share. You're just not seen as part of the group.
If that means I’m not liked, I’ll pay that tax.
1. doctor's appointment
2. picking up the kids from daycare
3. being an early bird and coming in way earlier than everyone else
4. working part-time
Just from the top of my head.
In any case, I am absolutely against slaving yourself for your employer and that is not what I meant at all.
Heck, I think 40 hours a week is too much -- I'd much rather see something closer to 32 hour work weeks, realistically.
In my career, the "awards" I get are kind of similar. I get the "Funniest Slack GIFS" awards where everyone else gets praise for releasing good features and fixing the most bugs and giving the best presentation. I do those things very well too, but somehow the public perception of me is that I'm a klutz or a goofball, even though I try to be serious and professional.
It's kind of frustrating. So to answer your question, no, I don't think that people like me and enjoy my presence. And I don't know how to be better.
But I never really knew how people I work with perceive me, beyond the coworkers I was really close with. I figured they mostly saw me as some sort of weirdo that they tolerate at best.
Then one day, I left a job and went back to the same company a few weeks later. On day 1 of my come back, within the first 5 minutes of doing a mock welcome - I already knew everyone in this new team, another lad came behind me and lifted me up, in a celebratory fashion.
It was really unexpected but it's one of my fondest memory. This took place in small satellite office with an overall great vibe, so YMMV.
But all in all, I don't think there's anything wrong with being recognized for the morale boost you might provide to your surroundings.
Yes you ship with the best of them, but you are also the glue making the individuals a team. That's something to be proud of.
(To be fair, the same can be said about threads, but in my experience, people are way more consistent about using emoji reactions than they are about properly threading their conversations.)
I was literally pissed, that I worked my ass off, and my father doesn't care that I am first as well in my class. He cared about the difference in percentage. So, I decided not to give a damn about my father's approval and till now I still give a damn about it, as he always comes out with some really high bar.
I recently have learned the Mantra to compare oneself today with oneself yesterday, or the week before, or a month before, or a year before. You can always find a balance of good and bad with the passage of time.
Think of it as an opportunity to see how effectively you're promoting your work. Are you just letting your work speak for itself? Environment depending, you could benefit from a strategy for [shameless] self promotion.
People generally seem to like working with me, and I could easily consider a lot of my current and past co-workers good friends.
I'm almost certainly not the person my co-workers would choose to be friends with or go out of their way to have present when not at work. I'm totally cool with that. The feeling is mutual.
But I'm also fairly certain that (while even our best friends always have some habits we find irritating) for the most part they find me pleasant enough to be around and interact with.
It matters to me that my colleagues find me pleasant and easy to work with, friendly, and not grating. It doesn't matter much to me whether they particularly like me as a person as long as our interpersonal relationship is good enough to effectively facilitate our professional relationship.
On the other hand, if I find you frustrating to work with on a professional level, it doesn't matter how pleasant you are to have a beer with. I'm going to resent you and wish we didn't have to work together.
Just make sure to keep your boss happy, and keep your coworkers and/or reports from literally hating you and you’re fine.
Trying to do anything more than that could lead you to developing social anxiety. There’s no way to truly understand what’s in someone else’s mind, so unless someone comes to you with a specific, actionable complaint don’t worry too much about what they think of you.
Improv skills help, if (like me) you aren't brilliant at conversations, treat them more like a game, "yes and" to keep things flowing.
The thing is, you have to care about people for them to like you. Be genuine with them, be there for them and don't be a dick. Have integrity. Allow them to know that you're a human being that makes mistakes, that you're imperfect and that's fine and you're comfortable with that in you (and others).
Ask for help when you need it, and offer it when you have it. Specially around things people really care about.
Also, and this is the hard part, work on yourself, on your self-esteem, on being better at dealing with your own emotional state. This transfer to others too and makes all the other stuff come easier.
My coworkers held a little going-away party for me, and gave me a custom trophy they'd had made with my (IRC) name on it -- just for being me.
So I feel confident in saying that, back when I worked in software, my coworkers enjoyed my presence, and management put up with me.
I would like to recommend this small exercise based on the game theory called "Evolution of Trust", https://ncase.me/trust/
At the end of this exercise there were three findings: 1. Repeat Interactions 2. Look for a possible win-win situation 3. Low Miscommunication
Definitely, as I said in the start, there is a lot more than a few factors that affect a colleague likeness/dislikeness towards you. The biggest lesson from above exercise in response to your questions would be:
"In the short term, your environment defines how people like you, but in the long term, it is you who defines the environment. So, do what you can do to improve conditions necessary to evolve trust, build relationships, communicate clearly."
If it is important that you want people to like you, then communicate clearly.
Ask them, "Have you ever thought, Why do you think any colleague should like you?". Tell them, what are the reasons you like them professionally and personally, and ask the favor back.
I do it every time whenever I have a question of like/dislike related to a colleague.
It can be pretty hard to know whether work friendships are genuine. It’s worth assessing what you want, and whether it actually matters to you. It’s much easier to get what you want when you know what it is.
Also turn the question around and ask yourself whether you care about others at work, and whether you like them and enjoy them. Are you letting them know in verbal or non-verbal ways? How often are you putting yourself in a place to be judged? For example, do you invite coworkers to your place for drinks/dinner/games? Some indicator might be whether people will do things with you outside of work, if you want that.
Work relationships, like school, usually are happenstance. You’re all employees making a living and the company controls making a living. It should be expected that some work friendships are a matter of employment or situational convenience and not deep lasting bonds.
Personally, I do feel somewhat liked at work, but it’s starting to matter less to me. I do usually try to be likable and also contribute, and those things do help. They way I actually know whether people liked me usually comes much later, often after I’ve left the company. The way I know is by finding who’s interested in catching up with me on social media, or getting together to hang out or reminisce, or even start a new side project.
Seeking out some people with shared interests outside of work can help. At one company, I started a mountain biking club, and made some friends by welcoming newcomers and helping people learn how to ride.
It has in the past felt like more people liked me when I’ve been a manager. That also fades faster and becomes apparent that it’s more often ‘purely by interest’ as you put it.
It's difficult to estimate how many people I've worked with. I've built good rapport with dozens of individuals throughout the years, but I'm still in touch with only one person.
This doesn't bother me, as my personality has nothing to do with work. My opinions, to which I'm entitled, are equally upsetting to both sides of the political divide. I don't take part in office parties, and I'll never join my colleagues on a company-sponsored beach retreat. My personality is my own, and liking me isn't a prerequisite to working productively together towards shared goals.
All this is to say: work isn't life, and life isn't work.
I try to be as genuine and forthcoming in helping those around me learn and grow with anything I learn as I grow.
I've also had jobs where my name brought with it a reputation for expecting results and answers without hearing the life story behind it. It was best to e-mail me for a quick reply and if you see headphones on, don't wave in my face.
I did my work. I did it well.
I was honest good or bad.
I taught rather than bragged.
I set a few ground rules for myself before joining: No social media interactions with people from work. Invitations can be deferred until after you no longer work together. Don't get suckered into talking about politics or other divisive topics. Keep it professional and always do the right thing.
With that in mind, to answer your questions:
Did people like me? Heck yes they did! It was easy! I'd walk right up and introduce myself to everyone I didn't know whenever the opportunity presented itself. I'd learn about them as much as I could and tell them about what I did and hopefully we'd be able to help each other. I'd ask people how things were going and try to hang out with people as much as I could during lunch / coffee breaks.
But more importantly, did they respect me? It was clear to everyone why I was there. I was there to make my team succeed despite everything that was going on outside my team. This meant that there was plenty of work to be done beyond what my title suggested.
I am Deaf and they sometimes didn't know what to do with me. I lipread but have difficulties in meetings. I also avoided joining social gatherings, for example coffee breaks, because lipreading is, well, exhausting. Still, I delivered code and the company was satisfied with my work, and sometimes they were surprised about that.
So people perhaps tried to like me and enjoy my presence, but probably felt unconfortable instead pitying me and asking themselves how they would manage if they were Deaf.