Hi HN, I’m Soham Sankaran, the founder of Pashi, the company behind Saag as a Service (https://saag.pashi.com). We offer three macronutrient-portioned variants of Saag (delicately-spiced Indian spinach curry): High Fat Saag Paneer, Balanced Saag Tofu, and High Protein Saag Seitan. We currently deliver weekly to customers in the SF Bay Area.
I started this service because I’ve struggled with nutrition all my life -- with obesity, the threat of my long family history of diabetes, and with getting adequate protein as a vegetarian in the United States. I’ve never had the time to consistently cook all my meals, and it’s hard to know the nutritional value of food you’re getting at restaurants unless you stick to salads or chain fast food (which is required to have nutritional information but is routinely off by 20-40%). Even if you know the nutritional values of the food you’re eating, attempting to log all your meals and snacks in a journal or an app like MyFitnessPal can be a massive time-sink and mental load.
‘Complete nutrition’ products like Soylent and Huel were appealing for relieving the physical and cognitive burden of dealing with nutrition all the time, but I perceived two major issues with them:
1) They taste absolutely terrible. These products are a massive step backward from thousands of years of accumulated culinary experience, and I don’t believe that most people are willing to forgo the pleasure that comes from eating real food three times a day, even if some kind of meal replacement is the right choice for their health. The biggest issue with diet plans and nutrition studies of all kinds is pervasively low adherence -- it just isn’t possible to get most people to consistently eat food that doesn’t taste good.
2) The retail versions of these products are not particularly customizable. Different people have different nutritional needs -- certainly calorically, but also in terms of macronutrient proportions. A female weightlifter and a male endurance runner have different bodies and different goals, resulting in different optimal nutritional profiles. Feeding them the same one-size-fits-all meal replacement is a mistake.
I stated Pashi to provide a real-food based nutrition service that tastes great but still retains the desirable characteristics of things like Soylent. The long term vision is to usher in a world where people can eat real, tasty food that is seamlessly customized to the specific nutritional profile they desire.
I initially soft-launched Pashi as a producer of entire meals with fully customizable calorie counts and macronutrient proportions, but this seemed to confuse people and didn't get very much traction. As a result, we’ve scaled back the focus to one of the most popular, customizable, and easily explainable foods on our menu -- Saag. If this gets some traction, we’ll introduce more fine-grained nutritional customization and more menu items depending on the feedback we get from our users.
I’d love to get the community’s thoughts on this and answer any questions here or via email (soham@pashi.com).
Thanks! We currently handle delivery ourselves. What area are you in? If you're in the Bay Area but not in our coverage area, email me (soham@pashi.com) and we can try to make it work.
I notice your zip codes aren't numerically sorted, at first I thought mine (94117) wasn't available, because it wasn't in the first block of 94. Might want to sort them, or just allow people to type it in. Cool product though! I'm ordering some now.
The Saag Paneer option has a lot more fat, which is why we targeted that at folks looking for a keto-friendly option, but this is indeed somewhat amusing.
When I saw Saag as a Service I was hoping for some kind of API where I could place and order through curl or something! Kinda like the EverQuest 2 pizza command.
The long-term vision for this, which we hope to fulfill once we get some traction, is an API that allows you to order food such as Saag with arbitrary nutritional values (within a certain range). We don't have the volume for that yet, but with your help maybe we can get there soon!
Changing the proportions of the ingredients -- in the case of saag, we could mix and match paneer, tofu, seitan, and a side of a carb like rice to produce any reasonable macronutrient ratio.
This is really nice! As a Hindu & vegan I wish I lived in your delivery zone :) (I live way out in the Pacific ocean, though) In any case, cool to see you're trying a more narrow approach, and the website explains things well and looks great. One question I was left with is how big is the portion? I may have missed that. And if this were available to me I'd be eager for the next available item to be chana masala. Thanks for sharing
Each portion is 500 calories. We serve them in 16oz containers, but the volume of Saag depends on the variant ordered (to make sure they are all the same number of calories).
Does anyone else who went to Stanford in the 00's remember Tiffin Dinner? Delicious homemade Indian food delivery, sadly closed. That got me through the quarter when I had a broken ankle..:
Oh yes of course, it's sarson. My bad. Big misconception corrected. My only association with saag was sarson ka saag, before I came to America, where I found it interchangeably used with palak in palak paneer.
From the website it looks like you are using spinach for this. In which case, Palak as a Service is actually the less misleading term. People associate Saag with either mustard leaves or at least a mix of green leaves. If it's only Palak, calling it saag might not be technically wrong but it's still not what people associate with that name.
Really like this concept! As a vegetarian, I have come across many other services that focus on nutritionally customizable products, but when it comes to vegetarian options, the macros / protein numbers leave a lot to be desired. I've also noticed that a lot of the vegetarian options available at restaurants in the bay tend to be much more carb heavy than I would prefer, and it takes a lot of overhead to research / optimize each and every meal.
I'm always looking for ways to algorithmically optimize my meals, and currently Chipotle and their app does the best job of enabling this in a standardized way (can pretty easily get nutrition info and hook it into other apps) , but it ends up being pretty boring on a routine basis. Something like this, with an expanded product line would be really useful.
Absolutely, these are the exact reasons I started this. We plan to expand to more dishes as we scale, but for now, if you're in the Bay Area, I hope we can at least help liberate you from the monotony of Chipotle.
Had a few of those around my place growing up (Nikki’s, around Orange County, CA), but they’ve all gone out of business by now. Absolute tragedy - the food was terrific and dirt cheap.
Would love a low-down / interview from a founder of one of these chains (there's also Curry Up now in the bay area) on the economics of making an indian fast-food joint. It might be a one-sentence article saying "demand", but I am sure there is a lot to unpack.
I've always thought that tandoori chicken was an unexplored opportunity. Think a similar model to the orignal Boston Chicken (now Boston Market), or El Pollo Loco on the west coast of the U.S.
To find that holy grail just replace -as-a-service with -do-it-yourself. The first time is hard. The eleventy-first time is like breathing. Plus a lot of satisfaction.
They had one of these places in downtown Palo Alto (Town and Country shopping center). It lasted a year or two, despite being directly across from Palo Alto High School, which every day mobbed the shopping center with lunch traffic. I was surprised it went under so quickly. Apparently it is not quite the holy grail after all? I went there and liked it well enough!
Trader Joe's seemed to discontinue their $2/8oz pouch packaged saag paneer about a year ago, and I haven't yet figured out how to make one I like on my own, and even when I do, I might not always want to spend the time on it.
Hope I get a chance to try this in LA before too long. :)
Love the idea and the implementation! I am living in Dubai and have the exact same struggle with finding an appropriate vegetarian meal delivered that is healthy and not a salad.
I'm a software engineer too and would love to help out with the tech if you need.
What benefit do you provide over the Indian place down the block with similar or even cheaper pricing? These prices are absurdly expensive even for us overpaid tech folk.
I mean... that's my point. I can plan ahead and pay $12 to have something delivered and then heat it up myself, or I can pay $12 to pick it up already hot and ready to eat, on demand.
For a spinach curry (saag or saag paneer), yes, $12 is very expensive.
In my local asian grocery store, they stock a lot of vacuum packed Indian meals, all of which have nothing "dodgy" in the list of ingredients, and all of which are actually really good - they cost the equivelant of around $2.5 each.
My local Indian takeaway restaurants sell saag paneer for around $4 USD.
Our main differentiator is specifying the macronutrients and allowing you to pick between different macronutrient profiles. You're not likely to get that at your local Indian place.
Great idea, a couple of comments.
- please let us know how you source your ingredients. Spinach is one of the more pesticide ridden vegetables. And bad quality dairy may do more harm than good.
- Seitan and tofu are not particularly healthy. Gluten and soy are known to be inflammatory foods and cause a lot of side affects. Would love to see a dairy-free, gluten-free, soy-free, organic version of this. Then it’s a truly hearty meal that I would order
Nice one! Did not realise the market for vegan cooked food in the bay area is this big.
How are you planning to scale saag as a service?
I am tempted to ask after looking at your profile, is the cooking/portioning/packing done by a robot? is that your secret sauce behind scale up possibilities?
I take offense to the high fat saag being portrayed by some fat bastard playing at an arcade machine while the other two images are of fit people doing healthy exercises. A high fat meal is key to getting energy for grueling tasks. This should be changed.
This was intended to represent a 'Classic' arcade game (Saag Paneer is the traditional preparation), not as a comment on physical activity. My apologies for any offense caused, and I'm happy to take suggestions for a new illustration. Email me at soham@pashi.com if you'd like to talk further.
The other images are comments on physical activity though, so it’s not hard to see how an image of a video gamer is also a comment on the physical activity of those who eat Saag Paneer.
If you are going for a classic vibe, then just have an Indian man in classic Indian clothing doing something classically Indian, or just stirring a pot or something. An arcade machine is not an association readily made with food.
In fairness to you, I wouldn't really call this "offensive". It does possibly play into the "fat, game-addicted neckbeard" stereotype, but this is more likely a case of a startup not having the resources to do extensive testing on different imagery. You could try running some a/b tests with different logos, though, and measure your conversion.
That’s your opinion, I personally think it tastes great and haven’t had issues drinking it over the past 4 years. Given that Soylent has continues to grow signals that other consumers agree (investors also agree given they’ve raised $50m led google ventures).
Also your product costs $12 per 500 cal (vs. $2.42 for 400cal for soylent) which is a huge selling point for people that drink soylent (it’s affordable, convenient and better than most fast food alternative)
I think it ultimately depends on the circle of people and what kind of cuisine they have normally. I think Soylent tastes quite mediocre- but my favorite foods are curries and vinegar/chili oil sauces. (Sad to say I often have meal replacements as punishment food.)
I would definitely try this saag as a service(alas, I live in NYC), as a healthy alternative to food I already love eating. Meal replacements are definitely not covering that niche for me.
Perhaps "taste absolutely terrible to me" would have been better phrasing. I think Soylent has its place, and I'm glad it exists.
In terms of price, food is expensive to make (especially in the Bay Area), but as we scale we think we can leverage automation to bring the price down to $6, which is not as cheap as but in the same ballpark as Soylent.
Increasingly, it seems like Indian restaurants where I live are including southern Indian menu items with lentils, and I was happy to see something beyond the usual at first and then disappointed that stuff like dosa, medhu vada, etc, seemed pretty meh.
And I've tried mulligatawny soup at one of those places and been really disappointed.
But there is an Indian/Pakistani restaurant near me that has lentil soup I really liked and in fact that's what inspired me to start experimenting at home as I was afraid they would go out of business.
Some months ago I made lentil soup and through sheer luck, happened on a combination of spices and other ingredients that made it really, really good. Unfortunately I didn't take good notes, and I'm not sure how to recreate it.
So what I'm saying is lentils can be anything you want, it's all in the execution.
Increasingly, it seems like Indian restaurants where I live are including southern Indian menu items with lentils, and I was happy to see something beyond the usual at first and then disappointed that stuff like dosa, medhu vada, etc, seemed pretty meh.
Indian food in the United States has, IMO, fallen into the same trap that Mexican food has. You get one or two items (e.g. chicken tikka masala or burritos) that represent a small region of the source country and that's about it. Or maybe you'll get some more unusual regional stuff and then half hearted burritos.
So what I'm saying is lentils can be anything you want, it's all in the execution.
Apropos of nothing there's a co-op restaurant in Sydney named "Lentils as Anything". It's named after an Australian band but hey it works here too ;)
Soylent growing and getting more funding doesn't necessarily mean people like its taste, it means that it solves a problem better than some other competing products for some customers.
I’ve experienced issues with five separate version numbers of Soylent powder over the past five years (and two versions of the Soylent drinks, and two versions of Meal Squares), to the point that my body now considers this entire category of “constructed” food products unappetizing and would rather skip a meal than consume any of them.
Your statement that it’s “affordable” is valid only the sense that it’s cheaper per calorie. Declaring it “better” without qualifiers is, to use your own words, “your opinion”, and declaring it “convenient” presumes that it is nutritionally valuable to all, which in my case and in this founder’s case, it cannot be for flavor or digestive rejection reasons.
Please take more care when declaring your opinion not to misrepresent it as fact. Evangelizing a competing product in a Show HN isn’t going to earn you much favor to begin with, and misleading people by stating opinions as fact will only undercut your message further.
Excited to try this! Saag is one of my favorite foods but almost impossible to eat at restaurants because of dietary restrictions (lactose-intolerant and keto). So I've been making my own healthy versions at home for years. It would be super helpful if you could include more ingredients info. For example, I would order the saag tofu, but I'm curious where the fat is coming from (assuming coconut milk base, my version is still leaner). Thanks Soham!
Great! The fat is coming from the vegetable oil used in the curry. If you have other specific questions about ingredients, feel free to email me at soham@pashi.com
I would have bought some in a heartbeat if it was available in Tokyo. I'd suggest adding a list of ingredients for intolerances and allergies, but this already looks like a very appealing product.
175 comments
[ 5.9 ms ] story [ 206 ms ] threadI started this service because I’ve struggled with nutrition all my life -- with obesity, the threat of my long family history of diabetes, and with getting adequate protein as a vegetarian in the United States. I’ve never had the time to consistently cook all my meals, and it’s hard to know the nutritional value of food you’re getting at restaurants unless you stick to salads or chain fast food (which is required to have nutritional information but is routinely off by 20-40%). Even if you know the nutritional values of the food you’re eating, attempting to log all your meals and snacks in a journal or an app like MyFitnessPal can be a massive time-sink and mental load.
‘Complete nutrition’ products like Soylent and Huel were appealing for relieving the physical and cognitive burden of dealing with nutrition all the time, but I perceived two major issues with them:
1) They taste absolutely terrible. These products are a massive step backward from thousands of years of accumulated culinary experience, and I don’t believe that most people are willing to forgo the pleasure that comes from eating real food three times a day, even if some kind of meal replacement is the right choice for their health. The biggest issue with diet plans and nutrition studies of all kinds is pervasively low adherence -- it just isn’t possible to get most people to consistently eat food that doesn’t taste good.
2) The retail versions of these products are not particularly customizable. Different people have different nutritional needs -- certainly calorically, but also in terms of macronutrient proportions. A female weightlifter and a male endurance runner have different bodies and different goals, resulting in different optimal nutritional profiles. Feeding them the same one-size-fits-all meal replacement is a mistake.
I stated Pashi to provide a real-food based nutrition service that tastes great but still retains the desirable characteristics of things like Soylent. The long term vision is to usher in a world where people can eat real, tasty food that is seamlessly customized to the specific nutritional profile they desire.
I initially soft-launched Pashi as a producer of entire meals with fully customizable calorie counts and macronutrient proportions, but this seemed to confuse people and didn't get very much traction. As a result, we’ve scaled back the focus to one of the most popular, customizable, and easily explainable foods on our menu -- Saag. If this gets some traction, we’ll introduce more fine-grained nutritional customization and more menu items depending on the feedback we get from our users.
I’d love to get the community’s thoughts on this and answer any questions here or via email (soham@pashi.com).
Do you deliver yourself, or are you using a delivery service?
By the way in re. your comment below -- the Saag Tofu is vegan and free of animal products.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironic_(song)
Good luck!
Mustard is Sarson, if my Hindi isn't failing me.
I'm always looking for ways to algorithmically optimize my meals, and currently Chipotle and their app does the best job of enabling this in a standardized way (can pretty easily get nutrition info and hook it into other apps) , but it ends up being pretty boring on a routine basis. Something like this, with an expanded product line would be really useful.
-Srasa Kitchen (Southeast Asian): https://www.srasakitchen.com/
-Bibimbowl (Korean): http://www.thebibimbowl.com/menu.php
I'm sure there are others, but these 2 are my tried and true favorites.
Hope I get a chance to try this in LA before too long. :)
In my local asian grocery store, they stock a lot of vacuum packed Indian meals, all of which have nothing "dodgy" in the list of ingredients, and all of which are actually really good - they cost the equivelant of around $2.5 each.
My local Indian takeaway restaurants sell saag paneer for around $4 USD.
How are you planning to scale saag as a service?
I am tempted to ask after looking at your profile, is the cooking/portioning/packing done by a robot? is that your secret sauce behind scale up possibilities?
All the best! looks tasty...
Other than that, the site looks great!
Bonus points for simplifying down to an MVP, and S(pinach)aaS has a really good ring to it for the SF HN crowd.
Am also looking forwards to non-spinach options! (I'm allergic)
If you are going for a classic vibe, then just have an Indian man in classic Indian clothing doing something classically Indian, or just stirring a pot or something. An arcade machine is not an association readily made with food.
That’s your opinion, I personally think it tastes great and haven’t had issues drinking it over the past 4 years. Given that Soylent has continues to grow signals that other consumers agree (investors also agree given they’ve raised $50m led google ventures).
Also your product costs $12 per 500 cal (vs. $2.42 for 400cal for soylent) which is a huge selling point for people that drink soylent (it’s affordable, convenient and better than most fast food alternative)
I would definitely try this saag as a service(alas, I live in NYC), as a healthy alternative to food I already love eating. Meal replacements are definitely not covering that niche for me.
In terms of price, food is expensive to make (especially in the Bay Area), but as we scale we think we can leverage automation to bring the price down to $6, which is not as cheap as but in the same ballpark as Soylent.
And I've tried mulligatawny soup at one of those places and been really disappointed.
But there is an Indian/Pakistani restaurant near me that has lentil soup I really liked and in fact that's what inspired me to start experimenting at home as I was afraid they would go out of business.
Some months ago I made lentil soup and through sheer luck, happened on a combination of spices and other ingredients that made it really, really good. Unfortunately I didn't take good notes, and I'm not sure how to recreate it.
So what I'm saying is lentils can be anything you want, it's all in the execution.
Indian food in the United States has, IMO, fallen into the same trap that Mexican food has. You get one or two items (e.g. chicken tikka masala or burritos) that represent a small region of the source country and that's about it. Or maybe you'll get some more unusual regional stuff and then half hearted burritos.
So what I'm saying is lentils can be anything you want, it's all in the execution.
Apropos of nothing there's a co-op restaurant in Sydney named "Lentils as Anything". It's named after an Australian band but hey it works here too ;)
Your statement that it’s “affordable” is valid only the sense that it’s cheaper per calorie. Declaring it “better” without qualifiers is, to use your own words, “your opinion”, and declaring it “convenient” presumes that it is nutritionally valuable to all, which in my case and in this founder’s case, it cannot be for flavor or digestive rejection reasons.
Please take more care when declaring your opinion not to misrepresent it as fact. Evangelizing a competing product in a Show HN isn’t going to earn you much favor to begin with, and misleading people by stating opinions as fact will only undercut your message further.
Best of luck!