Ask HN: What is a science fact that blew your mind when you learned it?

76 points by itronitron ↗ HN
I'll go first. When I read that it takes a photon over 100,000 years to exit the Sun as visible light, I was completely astounded. Curious what other insights from science people have learned that were completely unexpected to them.

188 comments

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Obvious when you think about it, but I didn't realise for ages that all the planets orbit in the same plane.
Related: I was mind blown when I realized this is true for the pretty obvious reason that the various orbits "averaged" out.
Is the obvious reason because the sun is spinning? Or some other not so obvious reason I do not know of?
Well this may not be correct, but I'm assuming the plane they spin in is the same as the equator of the Sun and in the same direction as the Sun's rotation. That would make sense if they were made of "stuff" that was thrown out from the centre and clumped together.
Pluto does not orbit in the same plane - it is about 17° off. HOWEVER! Pluto is no longer considered a planet, making this science fact true. (It is now considered a dwarf planet instead).
Average density of the universe is about 1 proton mass per cubic meter
That's including dark matter, I think? With just the matter we can see, it's not even that.
we can see our nose all the time, but our brain filters it out.

if you close one eye and keep the other open you'll suddenly see one side of your nose.

We also have a blind spot in each eye where our optic nerve passes through our retina, which the brain constantly edits out.
Also while turning your head you don’t really see, but your brain pieces things together and plays an image of what it thinks you should see.
> Can explain Quantum gravity

> Can explain DNA

...

> Can see his own nose

That when we look up at distant stars, nebulas, & galaxies and the like...we are looking back in time. What we see could have been gone for decades, centuries, or longer.
“longer” is an understatement. The Andromeda galaxy, which is viewable by the naked eye, is 2.5 million lightyears away. And that’s the closest galaxy to us.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andromeda_Galaxy

One of the closest, anyway. Yeah, most distant objects observed are over 10 billion years "in the past".
Sort of similar to tree rings and even... dirt. We could probably dig in our backyards and find artifacts of 10,000 year old life. We are transient.
Not science, but Mathematics - That there are more ways to arrange a deck of 52 cards than seconds that have elapsed since the big bang took place.

Thousands of similar questions on reddit for anyone interested- https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=science+fact+site%3Areddit....

Also chances are that no one has shuffled a deck in the same order as someone else has, ever in history.
This one gets me too. It's so counterintuitive to me.

(Caveat: this is assuming people shuffle well, which of course most people don't, therefore in fact people probably have shuffled to the same state).

From last few days I have been watching cards videos from numberphile. It's so fun and interesting.
Evolution is dominated by genetic drift, not natural selection, most of our genomes are junk, and we are in fact not very optimally adapted to our environments

The microbiome affects the brain, the immune system and is involved in multiple psychiatric/behavioral conditions

The identical ancestors point (in short, everyone is a descendant of everyone who ever lived approx 7000 years ago)

Mosaicism and chimerism - it's not clear "who we are" and it's not even "our genes"

Cancer behaves as though it were a living being of its own, there's evidence it could be a form of regression to unicellular lifeforms, and what's more it does have a microbiome of its own

Most of the facts stated are inaccurate, or at least phrased incorrectly in a pop science manner. What you have written are technical subtleties, not the main ideas that undergird biology. Biology is not an absolute hard science, but it serves nobody to emphasize and blow up the details while rejecting the core ideas completely. For example, if I tell a novice programmer that JavaScript is a compiled language like C, that is a very inaccurate statement. The subtleties of JIT interpreters can be clarified when you already have a clear understanding of the differences between an AOT compiler and a high level interpreter. HN is predominantly filled with people of math and computer science background. Those 'facts' in your comment are at best misleading if you do not already have strong grasp of the central dogma.
Alright then, let's see you phrase it better instead of just flagging my post with no justification other than a condescending dismissal.

At what point did I reject the core ideas though? And what does any of what I said have to do with the central dogma?

Growing up, I was taught that the main reason why it's bad to drink is because it kills brain cells and brain cells don't grow back. Apparently that is not the case anymore:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-adult-brain-d...

What level of drinking would cause this, though?
Come over to my house and I'll show you...

That's why haven't had a drink for the last 5 years

Well, i just meant i had not heard this - so i was curious if a glass of wine a night causes damage.
It's exercise that causes the brain growth.

(the famous rat experiment with the "stimulating environment" and brain grown was later attributed to the exercise wheel)

The 100-step rule in neuroscience, that states that no primary brain operation (e.g., face recognition) can take more than 100 neuron firing “steps.” (Feldman & Ballard, 1982)
This is a bit misleading since there are way more steps / neuron firings involved, the rule just says that these operations happen in less than 500ms and 1 firing per 5ms is the maximum throughput of a single neuron. These brain operations aren't implemented as a sequential chain of neuron activations though.
A 2016 poll of 1,500 scientists reported that 70% of them had failed to reproduce at least one other scientist's experiment (50% had failed to reproduce one of their own experiments).
I would love to see this number for computational scientists.
I don't have a clear reference to point you to but in many CS research fields these number are equally bad. Often code is not even published and is a complete mess when it is.
Reminds me of doing chemistry labs at uni. You follow the experiment plan and get nothing like the expected result so you add big error bars and your result matches.

i remember getting a clear linear relationship once that as supposed to be a curve. Solution was error bars and a curve to match expectation. Pointless

Not a fact per se, but: the sheer amount of living things that came before me, in the sense of my direct ancestors and their direct ancestors etc. etc – not only my human ancestors, but the whole of my ancestors all the way back to the origins of life itself – and I would not be here today if even one of them would have died before reproducing... that manages to blow my mind every single time I think about it.
And it can be reeeeally depressing to think about for those that aren't having children.
Try counting the total number of your ancestors: you have 2 parents, they have 4 parents in total etc., i.e. 2^N where N is the number of generations. Going just 40 generations back (about 1000 years), you had 2^40 = 1,099,511,627,776 ancestors.
But not necessarily 2^40 unique ancestors. That is, the same person may be your ancestor by more than one route through the subsequent generations.
The dual slit experiment. Run the experiment with no one watching it, it produces result A. Run it again and watch it, it produces result B. Watching the experiment changes the result. WTF????
The dual slit experiment produces different results? I must be thinking of something else - I thought that electrons passing through a dual slit always produce an interference pattern.

Anyone got a link?

There is a long Wikipedia article at

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-slit_experiment

The most mind boggling aspect of this for me is the single photon version, which is under the "Interference of individual particles" section of the above article. The point is that you get an interference pattern even when only a single photon at a time is sent through the slits!

Yeah this is the point where you stare down into the rabbit hole.
It's false information. It's debunked multiple times. "Watching" means "placing or turning on an additional detector", which ruins interference pattern. To develop intuition, look at double slit experiment made at macro scale using walking droplet.
I'd really appreciate a few links to this. I am on a youtube binge lately watching quantum dynamics lectures for lay people. The constant talk about "watching" and "observers" drives me crazy. I refuse to believe anything has anything to do with whether or not anybody is "watching" anything. Bouncing photons off of it? Sure I can see how that would affect all sorts of things. But if the bouncing photons alter what's going on (and it seems they cause as much quantum decoherence as anything else might) then that's not the same thing as just "watching". That word implies to me "there are ambient photons or some other field or background that does not alter the experiment, and I am merely observing that background to get an idea what's going on within the experiment". If the experiment cannot be conducted without interference within an ambient background of photons flying around, or within some other medium we passively non-destructively-to-the-experiment observe, then we cannot currently be said to be "observing" anything at all with respect to that experiment. Let's just say that, can't we? If we can't not alter the relevant circumstances of what's going on, then let's just admit that, without using faulty and improper language to "describe" what's happening. Can somebody help me out with this?
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If you want to develop intuition, look at this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsaUX48t0w8 .

Please note that physics as science in general is advancing constantly, but mainstream physics advances in sprints. Currently, walking droplets and Pilot Wave Theory are not good enough to be included into mainstream physics.

You make a good point. The problem is interacting with the particles, e.g. the photons bouncing off them. Don't poke the particle -- it only interferes with itself. Poke the particle -- now it is entangled with your measurement device, that means zillions of other particles, which changes the interference patterns.

But it is more complicated that this. Consider https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elitzur%E2%80%93Vaidman_bomb_t... -- if you only poke the particle in a "parallel universe", that also changes its pattern in this one.

At the end, quantum physics says there are multiple "versions" of how the particles move, and those versions interfere with each other. By interacting with each other, particles become entangled, which means that the "versions" of their states are no longer calculated independently, but together.

There are disagreements of what exactly this means: some people believe that reality only has multiple "versions" on a microscopic level, but when the entangled configuration becomes large enough (how large? no one knows), the parallel computation collapses, one of these "versions" is randomly selected to become the actual reality and the remaining ones disappear. Other people believe that multiple "versions" is the whole story; that observing the outcome means that you (being composed of particles that follow the laws of physics) also become entangled with the particles in the experiment, and now there are multiple "versions" of you, each observing a different outcome.

So, I'd say you got it half-right. Yes, it is about "observation = interaction"; and "observer" is just a shortcut for "the thing that poked the experimental particle, optionally also a display connected to that thing, optionally also a person observing the display". (That is, you could also have a completely impersonal "observer", e.g. a machine that measures the particle but no one is looking at its display.) But quantum physics is a different thing than mere classical physics where you correct for photons being actual things that hit the measured particle. It means there actually are multiple outcomes, which then interfere with each other, at least on the microscopic level.

Exactly, there's no such thing as passively 'watching' a system at the quantum level.

In order to obtain the information you wish to 'observe', you need to interact with it.

That interaction 'collapses the wave function', or rather, you become part the wave function, but seeing it 'from the inside' looks different compared to from the outside.

I love the “bouncing droplet” experiments. There are some cool videos of it on YouTube for those that want an intuitive macroscopic analogy to how quantum mechanics work.
The physics & biology behind eyesight.

Our eyes collect light that is "left over"(not reflected) from other surfaces.

Can't explain why but I had always had a sense that objects somehow emanated their own "image". Learning that colors manifest themselves because every other wavelength was absorbed was fascinating.

Why do you say not reflected? It seems like the light that enters our eyes often has been reflected?
I'm thinking the parent commenter meant to say "not absorbed"?
That there is such a thing as deterministic chaos (aka the butterfly effect), ie. infinitesimal perturbations can quickly produce macroscopic changes, and all the philosophical implications that result from it.

That despite the apparent complexity of the weather many atmospheric phenomena can be explained from first principles with pen and paper calculations.

That the existence of elementary particles can be derived from simple symmetry considerations (That one blows my mind every time.)

That when we look out into the universe we see elements roughly in the same proportions as they appear on earth. (We are all made out of star dust!)

Isn't that just probability distributions?
I think "mind blown" is an accurate description when I first saw the Hubble Deep Field image:

https://hubblesite.org/contents/articles/hubble-deep-fields

I already knew that "the universe is incomprehensibly large", but seeing how many entire galaxies there were in a random dark patch of sky was eye opening to me.

Don't know exactly why, but thinking about the vastness of the universe always cheers me up. Thanks for sharing :)
As a kid, it used to weird me out to the point where I would forget what I was doing, get the chills, and enter a sort of trance. It never impacted me negatively, but pondering the scale of everything and how little of an impact we have on the grand scheme of the universe gave me a weird sensation.
Relatedly, my dad always told me that thinking about the vastness of the universe "weirded him out."

My hypothesis is that he has narcissistic tendencies so pondering the vastness of the universe only highlights his own insignificance. I've noticed similar reaction from people who visit a large city for the first time and get a sense of how small they are in the grand scheme.

Reminds me of the Total Perspective Vortex from Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy, which exposed an individual's insignificance in the universe.
It makes me sad.

Born too late to explore the world; born too early to live forever and explore the entire universe; born just in time to make dank memes.

> which states that entropy, or a loss of the energy available to do work, must rise over time.[2] Stars will eventually exhaust their supply of hydrogen fuel and burn out.

Since entropy is a statistical quantity, the second law of thermodynamics is a statistical statement. And because modern physics essentially deals with Hamiltonian systems, it can be proven that a time exists when entropy goes down again. The intuitive proof is really nice. Since energy is conserved, one can imagine the global state (position, momentum) as position in a park covered in snow. So someone walking through it will eventually walk over his own footsteps. Not precisely but it's arbitrarily close, the longer one waits.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poincaré_recurrence_theorem

I really like that theorem

somewhat related, I was so glad when I found out the reason behind a dim bulb that's just turned off appearing brighter when _you look away_.

The answer is in the density of rod cells (which are photon receptors of the eye that specialize in low-light) are concentrated on the outer edges of the retina. So if you look straight at a dim bulb - the photons hit the cone cells, which aren't sensitive enough, but if you look away, the photons hit the rod cells and you can see the bulb!

OMG me too. I was having an eye exam. The technician had a black field with a bunch of lines. Holding a rod with a white dot, and told to let them know when it disappeared.

I laughed, "Well that will only happen if you put it behind your back."

They laughed, "Everyone has an astigmatism where the nerves enter the eye. We are looking for that or any other issues."

I was so shocked when the dot disappeared.

Also happy to hear it was the normal blind spot.

There is one driving your car too. :)
Not if your mirrors are set correctly. Lean your head to the side window, set the mirror so that it just misses the tail end of your car. Position your head over the centre console, set the mirror. There is now approximately no blind spot. You can fine-tune by careful observation on a multi-lane highway as people pass/you pass others. Done correctly, there is no blind spot.
Upvoted but wanted to add that this also requires the right mirrors. If you try to tow some trailers with a vehicle that doesn't have tow mirrors, then you could have a blind spot, especially behind the trailer if it blocks your regular rear view mirror.
Holy shit... anyone reading that doesn't understand, follow that link and follow along. That was... terrifying when you think of the ramifications. What's more interesting with glasses, my blindspot is larger than without my glasses.

Wow... just... mind blown. I always read about it, but never experienced it... wow...

A gallon of gasoline creates 20 pounds of carbon dioxide.

So my trip to the grocery store could be adding as much carbon dioxide to the air as the groceries I pick up!

That is fascinating. A gallon of gasoline weighs 6 pounds, so it probably must be using 14 pounds of oxygen.
Let me add on. Your average big tree (oak, pine, maple, etc) after about 10 years of age, collect about 40 pounds of carbon dioxide every year. Again, averages, there are plenty of factors.

I use that as a way to visualize the problem with "a solution".

I was pretty amazed by the Casimir Effect when I first learned of it.

  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casimir_effect
I think I need to get an advanced degree just to be able to read that wikipedia entry.
How prion diseases work and spread. They're basically infectious lego. You may not thank me if you read about them...
I read somewhere they survive even 1000°C cleaning of stuff.

Maybe dental implements.

I get what you are saying, but it just occurred to me "survive" might not be fitting for these ... "things"? They are not quite "alive", are they?
Gravity is not really a force or objects "attracting" themselves but a consequence of the curvature of spacetime.

At least that's my pedestrian interpretation :)

What releases energy then, when objects are accelerated towards each other?
A compressed spring weighs more than the same spring uncompressed. The moon and earth weigh less together than if you weighed them separately and added the values together. Most of the weight of solid objects is due to the high speeds and binding energies of the elementary particles within them rather than the rest mass of the constituent particles. The number of particles that exist is relative to how fast you are accelerating. Everything that has energy (which is everything we know of) affects the gravitational field; this means that even photons are "attracted" to each other.

A non-relativistic quantum state will return arbitrarily close to its initial state an infinite number of times. There is such a thing as interaction-free measurements: you can take photos of things without ever letting light hit a detector and you can tell whether a bomb is "active" without actually interacting with the detonator.

Energy is just a number that is calculated as a function of the state of a closed system — that this number is a constant results from the time transitional invariance of the laws of physics. Similarly, conservation of momentum is due to the spatial invariance of the laws of physics, and conservation of angular momentum is due to rotational invariance. Also, conservation of energy does not hold under general relativity.

>Most of the weight of solid objects is due to the high speeds of the elementary particles within them rather than the rest mass of the constituent particles.

Wait i agree energy is mass but is this specifically correct? The rest mass is always much higher when i've seen it in equations.

Whoops, I forgot binding energy. But yes, rest mass of quarks is only about 1% of a proton or neutron’s mass.
>A compressed spring weighs more than the same spring uncompressed.

This is false. The dilemma is that you can't "just weigh" a compressed spring without assistance. However, you can get around it by weighing a compression device with the spring, both when it's compressing and not compressing the spring. The weight will be the same.

You could not practically ever measure the difference in a lab, but it’s still a real effect. Look up the stress-energy tensor. I could equivalently say that a spinning ball weighs more than the same ball when stationary.
W=mg

Weight is mass times gravity. It is the mass of the object. As affected by a single force - gravity. Gravity is a force.

A spinning ball has ANOTHER force acting on it, and therefore cannot be defined by "weight".

In short, this is an absurd statement that tries to redefine a scientific definition for...I don't even know? Sensationalism?

You are not considering the effect of general relativity. See theoretical physicist Professor Matt Strassler's page where he gives the exact same example of how energy can be stored that I did: https://profmattstrassler.com/articles-and-posts/particle-ph....

All forms of energy, including potential energy in the form of a compressed/stretched spring, couple to the gravitational field. Again, read about the stress-energy tensor for how this works.

> In short, this is an absurd statement that tries to redefine a scientific definition for...I don't even know? Sensationalism?

What I've said is not even remotely controversial in the physics community. Don't take my word for it; ask anyone who has taken a basic graduate course in general physics and they will agree that a compressed spring or a spinning ball weighs an imperceptibly (i.e., immeasurably) small amount more than the uncompressed spring or stationary ball, should you have a hypothetical scale that was so precise as to be able to measure the difference.

Will read and come back, maybe I am missing something. Thanks.
You’re assuming the Newtonian theory of gravity, the parent poster uses Einstein’s general relativity. These theories disagree on quite a lot; e.g. general relativity predicts that light is affected by gravity, while Newton’s theory would not since photons are massless particles. Einstein was proven right here too.

Note however that the quoted effect – difference in weight between a compressed and uncompressed spring – will realistically be so small that I doubt you could measure that in a lab. To get a sense of how small that effect is, try comparing the E=mc^2 mass-energy of a spring to its E=kx^2 compression energy...

> The number of particles that exist is relative to how fast you are moving.

I thought the existence of particles was relative to how fast you're accelerating? If it's relative to how fast you're moving, wouldn't that imply that absolute velocity exists, i.e. that given two objects with known relative velocity to each other, we could potentially establish which one was "really" moving and which one was "really" still?

Similarly, a fully charged Tesla (or other electric) vehicle weighs more than an uncharged one. The difference is roughly the weight of 10 human hairs, so it's absolutely negligible, but that application of E=MC^2 blew my mind the first time I saw it.
> There is such a thing as interaction-free measurements: you can take photos of things without ever letting light hit a detector and you can tell whether a bomb is "active" without actually interacting with the detonator.

Can you provide a link that talks about that? It goes against my understanding of why there's an uncertainty principle at all

That mitochondria have their own DNA and used to be separate organisms. Or when I heard that trees feed each other and fungi through their roots.
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Electrons in a copper wire do not travel at the speed of electricity. Not even close.

Electricity travels at nearly the speed of light.

Electrons themselves travel like molasses:

"In the case of a 12 gauge copper wire carrying 10 amperes of current (typical of home wiring), the individual electrons only move about 0.02 cm per sec or 1.2 inches per minute (in science this is called the drift velocity of the electrons.). If this is the situation in nature, why do the lights come on so quickly [when you flip the switch]? At this speed it would take the electrons hours to get to the lights."

This completely caught me by surprise, but it makes sense once it's pointed out. Imagine a pipe filled with solid balls that just fit in it, with little friction. If you push a ball in one end, a ball pops out the other almost immediately. But not the same ball! Even if you keep pushing balls in, that first one you pushed will take a while to get the other end.

Update: as rrobukef notes in a reply, this would be the case for direct current (DC). With the usual household alternating current (AC), the electrons barely move at all!

https://www.uu.edu/dept/physics/scienceguys/2001Nov.cfm

https://wtamu.edu/~cbaird/sq/2014/02/19/what-is-the-speed-of...

For AC, they move back as well. Thus electrons move less than 4µm from their original place (excluding Brownian movement, I assume)
Another mindblower: you can chuck a capacitor at the other end and you’ve got a circuit with one wire!

Hence you can get shocks from one live wire.

Yeah, Physics 2 blew my mind with things like this.

The electrons actually move mostly side to side as they bump into each other. Pushing power just pushes the ones further down the pipe into the light, not the ones entering the copper cable.

A ripple in a pool simply displaces the ball up and down vertically. The ball doesn't move along the wave
Movement of charge is more like wave in water than flow of water. Also, the current tends to travel on the outside (skin) of the conductor.
Now what if a wire was moving backwards in the opposite direction faster than the drift velocity? Could current still flow?
Actually, 0.02 cm * 60 seconds = 1.2 cm (not inches).