If they ignore the EU, the EU actually gets a chance to home grow a competitor that can then challenge them internationally once it's had time to grow. Google would probably happily lose money to the EU every year to stop a native English baidu or yandex from being built.
Because Facebook is so entrenched in what they offer that Google tried and couldn’t put a dent into them.
These companies are doing everything they can at all time to prevent being unseated.
I was talking with the CEO of a super popular clothing brand about 10 years ago. He knew completely that brands have a life span and you can’t stop every competitor or changing interests. This is baked into the model. You can now get these cloths at Walmart, part of the lifecycle.
Tech companies have figured out a way to extend the “hot” duration of their brands. You literally can’t get at them until they are on the down slope.
> Because Facebook is so entrenched in what they offer that Google tried and couldn’t put a dent into them.
I'd say it's because Google was so inept at trying to do so, the way TikTok wasn't.
Also I wonder why such brands like Nintendo, Mitsubishi, General Electric, Ford Motors, Philips, Siemens, etc all exist for a century or more, and likely will for another century. What kind of secret have these tech bros discovered?
Google failed to build a social network where enough people would willingly leave enough personal data for selling, even though initially the Plus had some high-caliber users to follow.
So they have to make do with GMail, that lacks the network effect of social media.
Google has been supporting Russian language quite competently since early 2000s. Yandex still remained quite popular in Russia. Google has been supporting Czech reasonably, AFAICT, but Seznam stayed and stays popular in Czechia.
Google may seem to have secured an unassailable position as a search engine, but DuckDuckGo and Kagi somehow found success despite that, banking on Google's shortcomings.
If something holds back an appearance of a German-built or a French-built web search engine, it's likely not the Google's hegemony, and of course not a lack of scientific and engineering talent, but some other reasons.
I wish there was a way to unfuck the EU. It's turning into a totalitarian nightmare. Untouchable corrupt EC. Who are they to police what is and isn't right?
It doesn't just concern Hamas, banning, no, censoring Russian media, previously COVID19, upload filters and artcile 13 (changed to 17) and the dubious votting, now this and chat control incoming.
The Internet is a space: it does not belong to anyone as a whole.
What the EU is trying to enforce is accessibility of certain internet content on their land; it's like building a wall on a parcel of land you own, to prevent stuff from entering from elsewhere. Wise or not, it's not an unreasonable kind of desire.
There is no 'the internet'. As much as my cypherpunk heart would want there to be, in the end you have hosts (clients, servers) and subscribers (people) and those are located somewhere, and the laws of that place dictate what you can and cannot do.
This is also why bulletproof hosting never ends well.
> they're at the forefront of good things for citizen.
Ah right, good things for citizens by wanting to 'ban' encryption. Because 'think of the children,' or some such. Most world governments aren't your friends, as much as you'd want them to be. EU *DOES* do stuff that's bad for their citizens. Just because they did x or y you agree with doesn't magically make them protector of mankind.
> You should be thankful for the EU, they're at the forefront of good things for citizen. It's like California but 20 years ahead.
There are a few good laws/directives regarding consumer protection, however, the EU is going nuts on internet surveillance and policing, resulting in absurd legislations that are going to hurt EU startups and IT businesses and their own citizen's freedoms IMHO.
As an American, I'm glad someone who shares interests with the US has the competence and power to regulate our tech megacorps. It seems like our government is totally disinterested in doing it themselves.
Yeah the eu should really be worried. When masses of people have no shame or fear hiding sympathy for obviously terrorist actions then there’s a massive massive issue at hand and thats not a YouTube or tiktok video. Thats a power vacuum that will manifest itself in grotesque ways in the coming future. The dark forces to be are only beginning to realise it.
Thats a dubious statement - I wrote about terrorist action sympathisers and you wrote about pro Palestine. Nonetheless people have died in france and the army is getting deployed while schools are getting closed in the uk and people told to hide their identity due to said terrorist action sympathisers - which btw have _nothing_ in common with plastine “freedom”.
Thats ambiguous for you for some reason. Pretty clear for anyone else - or perhaps anyone else outside the eu, which kinda strengthens my point of view. Nonetheless Palestine rights are moot for the coming century, but thats a different topic.
France is not the only EU country. If you don't mention a country, I'll assume any country in EU I like.
And it's only terrorism, until the oppressor gives up. Then it's a libration movement, or whatnot. Bunch of anti-colonial, liberation movements in Africa and elsewhere also weren't pretty.
Palestine's rights are not moot at all. They are as relevant as ever, maybe even more so, because now they're violated much more than before.
Why did Europe do this to themselves? I’ve seen the numbers and I’m sorry, but it isn’t sustainable. Especially when you factor in reproduction rates. Western Europe will be conquered by a caliphate within 100 years. A democratic colonialism.
Stated purpose of law: prohibits advocating genocide.
Actual effect of law: prohibits preserving evidence of genocide.
I know there’s, broadly speaking, a difference in how freedom of speech is defined in America versus Europe. The (slightly inflammatory) description above is why I personally find the “European” definition distasteful.
Yes, this is one of the most important problems with well-meaning censorship.
Objectionable content should not be deleted, but instead clearly marked, and possibly require some extra verification steps to access. But it should not be deleted and forgotten, if for nothing else then as an evidence for future crime investigations.
A publication platform is not an archive. Those videos don't just disappear if they aren't uploaded to YouTube. They aren't as accessible to absolutely everyone of course.
On a slightly different legal note, it's not entirely clear to me what evidential value videos uploaded to YouTube have. Providence would be tricky to establish.
Does anyone know if YouTube videos have ever been used as legal evidence in court before?
The protections of speech in the US are exemplary and I think Europe needs to move in that direction.
Some countries try to penalize insults because they undermine dignity, but I believe that not to be the case necessarily and the paternalizing approach can be even worse for that. In practice, if you look at online discussion, half of the population would be criminals and repeat offenders for that matter.
Most often these restrictions are indeed well-meaning, but not in every case and there are side effects you are describing.
Antisemitism got bad again, but it is restricted to a certain demographic and I don't like the idea to reduce rights because there are some problem actors.
This is certainly Hamas-created propaganda. I could see it inciting someone to join the cause. Yet it reveals that Hamas proudly digs up water pipes donated as humanitarian aid, to turn them into weapons of war. Is society better off if the government prevents this video from being shared?
Wow, that is wild. I’m going to intentionally not address the extremely disturbing pretense of all of this, but that shows some wild innovation. Literally making war machines from scraps and salvage.
Whatever their motives, I don’t see this ending well for them. It seems as though Israel has decided this is the end of Gaza, and I believe they are sufficiently infuriated, motivated, and emboldened to accomplish their goals.
Why is the EU singling this type of content out in particular? Surely anything Hamas would release would be considered with skepticism as the EU has a very different tradition. Are they nervous the residents of the EU would quickly become assimilated to the culture of Hamas based on their propaganda videos? I can’t imagine that happening. I don’t get it - why is this different?
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[ 6.7 ms ] story [ 115 ms ] threadBecause Facebook is so entrenched in what they offer that Google tried and couldn’t put a dent into them.
These companies are doing everything they can at all time to prevent being unseated.
I was talking with the CEO of a super popular clothing brand about 10 years ago. He knew completely that brands have a life span and you can’t stop every competitor or changing interests. This is baked into the model. You can now get these cloths at Walmart, part of the lifecycle.
Tech companies have figured out a way to extend the “hot” duration of their brands. You literally can’t get at them until they are on the down slope.
I'd say it's because Google was so inept at trying to do so, the way TikTok wasn't.
Also I wonder why such brands like Nintendo, Mitsubishi, General Electric, Ford Motors, Philips, Siemens, etc all exist for a century or more, and likely will for another century. What kind of secret have these tech bros discovered?
All those companies are continually changing their product. Google, sells ads people chose to look at. Facebook sells data people chose to give.
These are not diverse models.
So they have to make do with GMail, that lacks the network effect of social media.
Google may seem to have secured an unassailable position as a search engine, but DuckDuckGo and Kagi somehow found success despite that, banking on Google's shortcomings.
If something holds back an appearance of a German-built or a French-built web search engine, it's likely not the Google's hegemony, and of course not a lack of scientific and engineering talent, but some other reasons.
And we, the citizens have no way to fight back.
That's not democracy.
Whose turf is the Internet?
What the EU is trying to enforce is accessibility of certain internet content on their land; it's like building a wall on a parcel of land you own, to prevent stuff from entering from elsewhere. Wise or not, it's not an unreasonable kind of desire.
This is also why bulletproof hosting never ends well.
Ah right, good things for citizens by wanting to 'ban' encryption. Because 'think of the children,' or some such. Most world governments aren't your friends, as much as you'd want them to be. EU *DOES* do stuff that's bad for their citizens. Just because they did x or y you agree with doesn't magically make them protector of mankind.
https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/chat-control-2-0-eu-governm...
There are a few good laws/directives regarding consumer protection, however, the EU is going nuts on internet surveillance and policing, resulting in absurd legislations that are going to hurt EU startups and IT businesses and their own citizen's freedoms IMHO.
I can't offer free webspace with ads or host anything free anymore because I'm now responsible if the user writes anything unlawful.
Just 2 things.
The fact that anything a government points a finger at and says “terrorism” is literally illegal to disseminate should terrify everyone.
And it's only terrorism, until the oppressor gives up. Then it's a libration movement, or whatnot. Bunch of anti-colonial, liberation movements in Africa and elsewhere also weren't pretty.
Palestine's rights are not moot at all. They are as relevant as ever, maybe even more so, because now they're violated much more than before.
All of that applies to Israel too so what’s different?
Actual effect of law: prohibits preserving evidence of genocide.
I know there’s, broadly speaking, a difference in how freedom of speech is defined in America versus Europe. The (slightly inflammatory) description above is why I personally find the “European” definition distasteful.
Objectionable content should not be deleted, but instead clearly marked, and possibly require some extra verification steps to access. But it should not be deleted and forgotten, if for nothing else then as an evidence for future crime investigations.
On a slightly different legal note, it's not entirely clear to me what evidential value videos uploaded to YouTube have. Providence would be tricky to establish.
Does anyone know if YouTube videos have ever been used as legal evidence in court before?
Incriminating YouTube videos have been admitted in criminal courts many times; e.g.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2109698/Gary-Johnso...
https://www.dispatch.com/story/news/crime/2013/09/11/court-c...
https://www.nycourts.gov/JUDGES/evidence/9-AUTHENTICITY/9.14... (page 4)
https://www.occriminaldefenseattorney.com/blog/youtube-used-...
Some countries try to penalize insults because they undermine dignity, but I believe that not to be the case necessarily and the paternalizing approach can be even worse for that. In practice, if you look at online discussion, half of the population would be criminals and repeat offenders for that matter.
Most often these restrictions are indeed well-meaning, but not in every case and there are side effects you are describing.
Antisemitism got bad again, but it is restricted to a certain demographic and I don't like the idea to reduce rights because there are some problem actors.
I wonder if there is a cause and effect there?
This is certainly Hamas-created propaganda. I could see it inciting someone to join the cause. Yet it reveals that Hamas proudly digs up water pipes donated as humanitarian aid, to turn them into weapons of war. Is society better off if the government prevents this video from being shared?
Whatever their motives, I don’t see this ending well for them. It seems as though Israel has decided this is the end of Gaza, and I believe they are sufficiently infuriated, motivated, and emboldened to accomplish their goals.
[1] https://rumble.com/v3ol4sj-pure-censorship-eu-sends-musk-war... [1] https://rumble.com/v3odrq7-system-update-159.html