I've never been an anime fan, but Dragon Ball/Dragon Ball Z will always hold a place in my heart. Last year, I decided to read the series manga—the first and probably only I will ever read. In the forward of each volume, Toriyama talks about random little details of his life, like talking about his pets, a painful dentist visit, etc. This is probably common practice in manga, but as a westerner who has never seen such things, it was absolutely charming, and I enjoyed those glimpses more than I ever would have expected.
It's truly a tragedy that lagging interest in Dragon Ball deprived us of twenty years of his output. I'm thankful we got to appreciate his stunning return for the last nine.
70+ upvotes in 20 minutes, and it's rapidly slipping off the front page.
Dang: Are the mods nuking this story? If so, is this not a big deal for much of the HN readership?
Akira Toriyama was an icon for me during my adolescent years. I'm guessing most millennials here were similarly exposed to his work, and that it meant a lot to many amongst the readership here. Toonami, Adult Swim, early Internet culture...
The early web was highly topical place (personal webpages, forums), and one of those common topics was Dragonball. It was everywhere, and by percentage at a volume that can't be matched today by anything.
Edit: The ISS story at #1 is an hour old and has half the upvotes this article does. This story briefly topped, then rapidly started sinking (currently #13). What gives?
If I had to guess, a lot of mundanes don't understand how much anime was a part of early hacker / net culture and are probably flagging it for being offtopic.
it's not a conspiracy. It's the later in the evening in the US. Not on a major news url. Which also got changed from a foreign language one. Give it some time. Also your weight on the impact as far as the web is maybe too much. Define "early". It's nothing more than some ascii art and maybe some gifs to me. And I'm talking the actual early web, 90s. I do respect the cultural significance tho. That's easy to see. The title could be "...creator of Dragon Ball" to get more recognition/attention.
Well, some of the commentary are low quality and more akin to Reddit, but that’s a trend of HN in general.
When we have RIP threads for people in Computer Scientists, atleast that’s within industry and people are 1-2 degrees of separation with personal anecdotes. Most of the commentary Akira Toriyama are merely as fans.
This said, there’s been other examples of people who aren’t actually related to Computer Science, but was still trended, such as Ted Kaczynski. This could be the academia / academic bias of HN. On the hand, HN is a forum for entrepreneurship and business. The Dragon Ball franchise is one of the greatest economic exports of Japan.
> On the hand, HN is a forum for entrepreneurship and business.
If HN had been around in the late 80s I think there would have been a lot of people defending the real estate developers who inspired a particular DBZ villain.
One of the most infamous Linux User Group in Spain was called "BulmaLUG", because of the obvious geekery. The impact of Dragon Ball working as a gateway to different hobbies it's inmense: manga, scifi, computers...
Oh my, the Dragon Ball series of comics are wonderful memories from my childhood! I even want my kids to read these comics now! I hope Akira can rest in peace.
I believe it's meant to emphasize that despite being 68, he was still working hard for his fans. In Japan that's very much the way that these things are often portrayed, it's essentially eulogizing in a low-key way.
The Japanese is more like "he probably had many more things he wanted to do", no nuance of "there were tasks for us that were left unhandled by his passing".
It didn't come across as cold to me in English. I took it to mean that he loved his work, and kept at it right up until the end. i.e. a statement of admiration and praise for his passion.
Yeah, this is more of the nuance, my rough translation would be:
“He had many projects he was passionately working on and many more things he wanted to accomplish, it’s unfortunate (that he won’t be able to complete them)”.
Damn... Dragon Ball and Dr Slump were huge in France back in the days. There will be a lot of deeply saddened people tomorrow when it lands on front pages.
Dragon Ball transcends cultures, languages, and generations like few creative works I can think of do.
In that story he managed to capture the simple, profound truths of the human experience. Courage, friendship, resilience, the pursuit of one's dreams. A sense of a deeper purpose and meaning to life. A world full of new things to discover.
I am very sad to hear of his passing, but take solice in knowing that his works will outlive him.
> As much as I am a dude who loves his work, Dragon Ball is male centric
So? Are you implying that this makes it less important?
Barbie is female centric, and there's nothing wrong with that either. Gender doesn't matter in this context.
Gender has blown up as this big divisive, team sports thing recently, and honestly it's starting to become annoying and hurtful. It's okay for something to cater to a predominantly male or female audience. There's nothing wrong with that, and there never has been.
> So? Are you implying that this makes it less important?
OP claimed Dragon Ball is universal and transcendent. I'm merely nitpicking that it is not. Same as I would with barbie.
> there's nothing wrong with that either.
Didn't say there was.
> Gender doesn't matter in this context.
Well it is relevant because you just admitted Barbie is female centric.
> Gender has blown up as this big divisive, team sports thing recently, and honestly it's starting to become annoying and hurtful
Yes, and that's why I asked what is the response to my comment.
> It's okay for something to cater to a predominantly male or female audience.
Yes, I agree. That's why I pointed out that different manga genres exist. And no one refuted this point.
> There's nothing wrong with that, and there never has been.
I agree.
> There's nothing here to be offended about.
Exactly. I wasn't making any criticism nor was I offended about it. I was tunnel visioned on the philosophical point of something being universal and transcendent. It's everyone else who had a knee jerk reaction to my comment being some kind of gender criticism
According to Shonen jumps own statistics, about 40% of their readers are women. They are very well aware of that fact and takes that in to account when they accept new series in to the magazine.
However they're also aware that they have a theme, which explicitly is "friendship, effort and victory" and their reader, guys or girls, old or young, buy their magazines because they want to see stories around that.
I think you're down voted because you have a shallow understanding of the topic, decide to focus on a small part of it and can only see it through your cultural lens (and somehow think mentioning that on a post he died, is appropriate) And people can probably see that even if they don't fully understand how the Manga culture in Japan work.
And in fact, "shounen" (or "shonen") is a genre that encapsulates those very values. Thus Shonen Jump is called as such, not because it's for boys and boys alone.
>I think you're down voted because you have a shallow understanding of the topic,
As a Japanese, the guy deserves those downvotes for being a legitimate bigot.
Thanks for this. I read this as you presuming me to be a Westerner Social Justice Warrior making gender progressive criticism. Rereading my comment, I can see how it may be interpreted this way interpreted.
To be clear, my original comment was not a criticism of Toriyama Akira, nor a suggesting Japan needs to be more gender progressive. The fact that people project this issue and respond so defensively is an indicator that gender issues remain a thorn in Japan.
> According to Shonen jumps own statistics, about 40% of their readers are women
Do they report if 40% of their executives or artists are women?
In general, we shouldn't take a company or institutions words at face value and look at what they actually do. According to China Evergrande and FTX's own sheets, they had health balance sheets. By China and Japan's own statistics, they have conflicting numbers on geopolitical matters.
I'm not saying Shonen Jump is in the same group as shady companies, but they are a for profit organization. Of course they are increasingly financially incentivized to not limit their customer base. If they were serious about being universal, they can change their name. Let's not evade around the fact that Shonen doesn't literally means 'boy'. I'm not suggesting that Shonen Jump needs to change their name, I'm just saying if they actually cared about gender equality, other then profiting off half the population, you'd see this reflected more.
Even if this cherry picked statistic is true, there could be more to it. I acknowledge Shonen Jump is increasing its female reader base, but that doesn't mean the bulk of their content is male centric. Maybe there's one series that appeals to female audience.
> They are very well aware of that fact and takes that in to account when they accept new series in to the magazine.
So I'm not wrong to suggest that the industry and company has been, atleast historically, male centric?
> have a theme, which explicitly is "friendship, effort and victory"
It seems most of the victories are through physical combat. From my western "cultural lens", that's usually a sign of male centricity.
> their reader, guys or girls, old or young
Would love to see a statistic on what percentage of Shonen Jump's readers are 60 year old ladies.
> I think you're down voted because you have a shallow understanding of the topic... don't fully understand how the Manga culture
My understanding is shallow because the subject is not deep. It's only complex if you to do mental gymnastics to defend and explain away Japan's male patriarchy.
Since you want to portray that culture is more progressive then it is, and it is I who is ignorant to how progressive the culture is, can you enlighten me why all female artist collectives like this exist? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clamp_(manga_artists). Are there major publishing houses ran by such groups of women?
> (and somehow think mentioning that on a post he died, is appropriate)
I never criticized Toriyama Akira. It is people who are projecting gender progressive issues
Right, meaning boy. Which I originally stated as not being a deep topic. So why try to pretend Shonen Jump is this progressive brand for universal audiences. Doing mental gymnastics to twist the meaning of “boy” to mean this inclusive theme of victory for all.
> shojo and josei
But, as with many things Japanese, the boys and men take first precedence. Is this not indicative of the male patriarchy? Why not name
It Shojo Jump then? Does that make you uncomfortable? Or do you have some denialist answer about how naming it “Shojo Jump” would be awkward or “strange” in the Japanese language? If that’s strange, then it suggests to me the male patriarchy is so deeply institutionalized and embedded that you can’t possibly reason outside of it
Thank you for mansplaining the existence of Japanese feminist studies. Can you please mansplain why “women’s colleges” exist in Japan? And why feminist studies are almost always resigned to these institutions. To most Americans, that would be a weird and ironic concept.
You think asking whether any 60 year old women are actually readers is a “strange question”? Why? Because the answer is a statistically low number? Me too.
You’re agreeing and confirming my very points. Maybe you can’t pickup on the sarcasm and irony here.
> Right, meaning boy. Which I originally stated as not being a deep topic. So why try to pretend Shonen Jump is this progressive brand for universal audiences. Doing mental gymnastics to twist the meaning of “boy” to mean this inclusive theme of victory for all.
You are the only person here doing this. This is a magazine targeted at male audience and every person in this thread was telling you this. Does this mean girls don't read Naruto or One Piece? Of course not. This does not mean SJ is trying to be proggressive. And there is no reason for it to trying being one.
>But, as with many things Japanese, the boys and men take first precedence.
The fact that SJ sells 8 times more than Ciao indicates that boys (and some percent of girls) tend to spend more on manga with a certain set of traints.
>Why not name It Shojo Jump then? Does that make you uncomfortable?
No, it does not make me uncomfortable, it's just stupid.
You can name it "for girs and boys" or "for teens" - that would be completely ok with me personally and with anyone else.
>Can you please mansplain why “women’s colleges” exist in Japan?
I wasn't mansplaining anything. It is unfortunate that you see it this way but that's your problem, not mine.
As for the "why" - I'm not a culturologist to give you and aducated opinion on the topic (neither I'm a japanese, just to be clear), but as as I know many countries (including the US) have boys-only and girls-only schools\colleges etc.
>And why feminist studies are almost always resigned to these institutions.
If you give a few examples I can talk to an old friend on my. He is anthropologist in the University of Toronto. This is not his field, but maybe he can help finding someone with expertise in this question. _If_ you are actually interensted.
>You think asking whether any 60 year old women are actually readers
Of this specific mangazine, yes. Older women can read whatever they prefer, not questioin here. I just doubt that the % of them reading something like One Piece is very low.
>can you enlighten me why all female artist collectives like this exist
They literally where girl friends drawing yaoi dojinshi together. It's pretty common for a group of people with the same hobby to promote their hobby to a business.
Hopefully I don't have to explain why with was a girls-only "club".
> The man just died, and your initial reaction is "but his work was male centric". Find a better time.
Only if you're interpreting my comment to be a criticism . I never used the word "but" nor intended to detract from the significance of his work; it was not suggestion that Toriyama Akira's work could be improved (i.e. by being less male centric).
And no, that was not my initial reaction. If it was, I would have left a top level comment to this end. I did leave a top level comment, recognizing his other work Dragon Quest (since Dragon Ball is already recognized by this HN audience). My comment, again, is a specific nitpicking of OP's claim.
> ; it was not suggestion that Toriyama Akira's work could be improved (i.e. by being less male centric).
Why is it bad to have a male centric story? Diversity means that we have some male centric stories, some female centric stories, and some stories with both. You don't "improve" things by making everything more similar, you just remove diversity.
This sort of nitpicking really isn't appropriate for this time and place. It comes off as criticism of Dragon Ball for being aimed at boys, though I understand you did not actually intend that.
A mourning thread is not the place to start arguments about technicalities.
> It comes off as criticism of Dragon Ball for being aimed at boys, though I understand you did not actually intend that.
You're right. It was not a criticism nor value judgement of Dragon Ball, Toriyama Akira, nor Japan.
> nitpicking
You're right. It was a semantic nitpicking of OP's claim of universal transcendence.
> A mourning thread is not the place to start arguments about technicalities.
I agree with you in principal, but HN had no qualms starting arguments about technicalities and non-technicalities when it came to other mourning threads. Recently, there was a nobel nominee where more then half the comments were criticism. Things get especially tribal and protectionist whenever Japan and Japanese pop culture is involved.
> You're right. It was a semantic nitpicking of OP's claim of universal transcendence.
Here's the thing about nitpicking in a high emotion thread. You have to be completely correct if you don't want to be piled on... and especially here, you aren't.
The OP didn't make a claim of universal transcendence, they listed specific categories (cultures, languages, and generations) that the work transcends. Categories that most works don't transcend. This is inherently praise for the author.
Your bringing up of a separate category that it doesn't transcend when there was no original claim that it transcended this category is either off topic, or a criticism.
Despite the fact the story is male centric, it doesn't imply Toriyama-san is innate sexist. He was influenced by martial arts film and Bruce Lee, hence it is rather nature for him to create male characters.
DB/DBZ was my introduction to anime. What an introduction. As somebody coming out of russian/soviet oppression anime was absolutely unknown behind iron curtain. The whole concept that cartoons are not for small children only was quite a reveal.
I watched it with french voice over, which were then voiced over by a single polish male dubber with maybe 1-2s delay, so you could hear both languages. Needless to say I didn't speak neither of those, but understood a slight bit polish, and had an absolute blast.
DBZ has special place in my heart. Not so much stuff afterwards, DB itself a bit less, but DBZ hit a proverbial nail on the head (in my head) I didn't even know existed, and it hit it perfectly.
Subdural hematoma. So, falling. Hmm, a common cause in aged people. I wonder how many more life years we could add by helping deal with falling.
Like many others, DBZ was the first anime I watched. What an experience trying to get the pirated copies and watch them on RealPlayer. And we'd share fan AMVs like they were secret religious texts at school.
Dragonball was my first experience watching an anime dubbed in a language other than English. Surprisingly not in Japanese. It aired on local TV Telemundo 22 (I think? in Spanish) for Southern California. Before that my only exposure in the 90's to Japanese animation was Pokemon.
The man help inspire a whole generation of children to become artists, some of which have gone to become even more famous than him (Eiichiro Oda and so many more...), who then went to inspire yet more children who are breaking out now. This same man was inspired by Osamu Tezuka, the creator of Astro Boy, to express his talent to the world.
The man was a legend, from Dragon Ball, Dragon Quest, Chrono Trigger, Dr. Slump and so much more.
He help popularize and normalize anime outside of Japan for so many of us.
219 comments
[ 2.9 ms ] story [ 347 ms ] threadHe’s most famous for writing the Dragon Ball sagas, and drawing the characters for the Chrono Trigger game.
Slightly less known outside Japan is Dr.Slump, a funny manga/anime about a crazy scientist and his no-less-crazy robot-daughter Arale
I've never been an anime fan, but Dragon Ball/Dragon Ball Z will always hold a place in my heart. Last year, I decided to read the series manga—the first and probably only I will ever read. In the forward of each volume, Toriyama talks about random little details of his life, like talking about his pets, a painful dentist visit, etc. This is probably common practice in manga, but as a westerner who has never seen such things, it was absolutely charming, and I enjoyed those glimpses more than I ever would have expected.
Rest in peace.
Chrono Trigger is one game I'd love to see remade.
117 votes, 30 minutes old, currently at #10.
Thank you forever for designing the Dragon Quest Slime. Just a blue Hershey's kiss with a face, but it brings so much joy.
Dang: Are the mods nuking this story? If so, is this not a big deal for much of the HN readership?
Akira Toriyama was an icon for me during my adolescent years. I'm guessing most millennials here were similarly exposed to his work, and that it meant a lot to many amongst the readership here. Toonami, Adult Swim, early Internet culture...
The early web was highly topical place (personal webpages, forums), and one of those common topics was Dragonball. It was everywhere, and by percentage at a volume that can't be matched today by anything.
Edit: The ISS story at #1 is an hour old and has half the upvotes this article does. This story briefly topped, then rapidly started sinking (currently #13). What gives?
When we have RIP threads for people in Computer Scientists, atleast that’s within industry and people are 1-2 degrees of separation with personal anecdotes. Most of the commentary Akira Toriyama are merely as fans.
This said, there’s been other examples of people who aren’t actually related to Computer Science, but was still trended, such as Ted Kaczynski. This could be the academia / academic bias of HN. On the hand, HN is a forum for entrepreneurship and business. The Dragon Ball franchise is one of the greatest economic exports of Japan.
If HN had been around in the late 80s I think there would have been a lot of people defending the real estate developers who inspired a particular DBZ villain.
Related: how about an HN black bar?
Man, I hope that sounds less cold in the original Japanese than it comes across in English.
"It's such an inconvenience that our manga-ka died when he still had so much work left to turn in!"
“He had many projects he was passionately working on and many more things he wanted to accomplish, it’s unfortunate (that he won’t be able to complete them)”.
but on a serious note, holy hell I did not except the guy to leave so soon. Nobody can ever fill that void now
Still leaving a mark in my life, with Dragon Quest!
In that story he managed to capture the simple, profound truths of the human experience. Courage, friendship, resilience, the pursuit of one's dreams. A sense of a deeper purpose and meaning to life. A world full of new things to discover.
I am very sad to hear of his passing, but take solice in knowing that his works will outlive him.
So? Are you implying that this makes it less important?
Barbie is female centric, and there's nothing wrong with that either. Gender doesn't matter in this context.
Gender has blown up as this big divisive, team sports thing recently, and honestly it's starting to become annoying and hurtful. It's okay for something to cater to a predominantly male or female audience. There's nothing wrong with that, and there never has been.
There's nothing here to be offended about.
OP claimed Dragon Ball is universal and transcendent. I'm merely nitpicking that it is not. Same as I would with barbie.
> there's nothing wrong with that either.
Didn't say there was.
> Gender doesn't matter in this context.
Well it is relevant because you just admitted Barbie is female centric.
> Gender has blown up as this big divisive, team sports thing recently, and honestly it's starting to become annoying and hurtful
Yes, and that's why I asked what is the response to my comment.
> It's okay for something to cater to a predominantly male or female audience.
Yes, I agree. That's why I pointed out that different manga genres exist. And no one refuted this point.
> There's nothing wrong with that, and there never has been.
I agree.
> There's nothing here to be offended about.
Exactly. I wasn't making any criticism nor was I offended about it. I was tunnel visioned on the philosophical point of something being universal and transcendent. It's everyone else who had a knee jerk reaction to my comment being some kind of gender criticism
No he wrote:
> Dragon Ball transcends cultures, languages, and generations like few creative works I can think of do.
Nowhere did he say it is universal or that it transcends gender in anyway. You are arguing against nothing here.
However they're also aware that they have a theme, which explicitly is "friendship, effort and victory" and their reader, guys or girls, old or young, buy their magazines because they want to see stories around that.
I think you're down voted because you have a shallow understanding of the topic, decide to focus on a small part of it and can only see it through your cultural lens (and somehow think mentioning that on a post he died, is appropriate) And people can probably see that even if they don't fully understand how the Manga culture in Japan work.
And in fact, "shounen" (or "shonen") is a genre that encapsulates those very values. Thus Shonen Jump is called as such, not because it's for boys and boys alone.
>I think you're down voted because you have a shallow understanding of the topic,
As a Japanese, the guy deserves those downvotes for being a legitimate bigot.
Thanks for this. I read this as you presuming me to be a Westerner Social Justice Warrior making gender progressive criticism. Rereading my comment, I can see how it may be interpreted this way interpreted.
To be clear, my original comment was not a criticism of Toriyama Akira, nor a suggesting Japan needs to be more gender progressive. The fact that people project this issue and respond so defensively is an indicator that gender issues remain a thorn in Japan.
> According to Shonen jumps own statistics, about 40% of their readers are women
Do they report if 40% of their executives or artists are women?
In general, we shouldn't take a company or institutions words at face value and look at what they actually do. According to China Evergrande and FTX's own sheets, they had health balance sheets. By China and Japan's own statistics, they have conflicting numbers on geopolitical matters.
I'm not saying Shonen Jump is in the same group as shady companies, but they are a for profit organization. Of course they are increasingly financially incentivized to not limit their customer base. If they were serious about being universal, they can change their name. Let's not evade around the fact that Shonen doesn't literally means 'boy'. I'm not suggesting that Shonen Jump needs to change their name, I'm just saying if they actually cared about gender equality, other then profiting off half the population, you'd see this reflected more.
Even if this cherry picked statistic is true, there could be more to it. I acknowledge Shonen Jump is increasing its female reader base, but that doesn't mean the bulk of their content is male centric. Maybe there's one series that appeals to female audience.
> They are very well aware of that fact and takes that in to account when they accept new series in to the magazine.
So I'm not wrong to suggest that the industry and company has been, atleast historically, male centric?
> have a theme, which explicitly is "friendship, effort and victory"
It seems most of the victories are through physical combat. From my western "cultural lens", that's usually a sign of male centricity.
> their reader, guys or girls, old or young
Would love to see a statistic on what percentage of Shonen Jump's readers are 60 year old ladies.
> I think you're down voted because you have a shallow understanding of the topic... don't fully understand how the Manga culture
My understanding is shallow because the subject is not deep. It's only complex if you to do mental gymnastics to defend and explain away Japan's male patriarchy.
Since you want to portray that culture is more progressive then it is, and it is I who is ignorant to how progressive the culture is, can you enlighten me why all female artist collectives like this exist? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clamp_(manga_artists). Are there major publishing houses ran by such groups of women?
> (and somehow think mentioning that on a post he died, is appropriate)
I never criticized Toriyama Akira. It is people who are projecting gender progressive issues
This a very strange desire considering the magazine literally have word "shonen" in its title.
You do realize that they also have shojo and josei manga?
>My understanding is shallow because the subject is not deep.
Maybe you should do at least scratch the surface? https://www.animemangastudies.com/search-results/?Title=wome...
Right, meaning boy. Which I originally stated as not being a deep topic. So why try to pretend Shonen Jump is this progressive brand for universal audiences. Doing mental gymnastics to twist the meaning of “boy” to mean this inclusive theme of victory for all.
> shojo and josei
But, as with many things Japanese, the boys and men take first precedence. Is this not indicative of the male patriarchy? Why not name It Shojo Jump then? Does that make you uncomfortable? Or do you have some denialist answer about how naming it “Shojo Jump” would be awkward or “strange” in the Japanese language? If that’s strange, then it suggests to me the male patriarchy is so deeply institutionalized and embedded that you can’t possibly reason outside of it
Thank you for mansplaining the existence of Japanese feminist studies. Can you please mansplain why “women’s colleges” exist in Japan? And why feminist studies are almost always resigned to these institutions. To most Americans, that would be a weird and ironic concept.
You think asking whether any 60 year old women are actually readers is a “strange question”? Why? Because the answer is a statistically low number? Me too.
You’re agreeing and confirming my very points. Maybe you can’t pickup on the sarcasm and irony here.
OK, now do Shonen Knife.
You are the only person here doing this. This is a magazine targeted at male audience and every person in this thread was telling you this. Does this mean girls don't read Naruto or One Piece? Of course not. This does not mean SJ is trying to be proggressive. And there is no reason for it to trying being one.
>But, as with many things Japanese, the boys and men take first precedence.
You might want to read about economy and markets. The best selling shojo magazine (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Japanese_manga_magazin...) has numbers 8 times less then best selling shonen magazine. Which one will you be invesing in?
>Is this not indicative of the male patriarchy?
No, it is not.
The fact that SJ sells 8 times more than Ciao indicates that boys (and some percent of girls) tend to spend more on manga with a certain set of traints.
>Why not name It Shojo Jump then? Does that make you uncomfortable?
No, it does not make me uncomfortable, it's just stupid.
You can name it "for girs and boys" or "for teens" - that would be completely ok with me personally and with anyone else.
>Can you please mansplain why “women’s colleges” exist in Japan?
I wasn't mansplaining anything. It is unfortunate that you see it this way but that's your problem, not mine.
As for the "why" - I'm not a culturologist to give you and aducated opinion on the topic (neither I'm a japanese, just to be clear), but as as I know many countries (including the US) have boys-only and girls-only schools\colleges etc.
>And why feminist studies are almost always resigned to these institutions.
If you give a few examples I can talk to an old friend on my. He is anthropologist in the University of Toronto. This is not his field, but maybe he can help finding someone with expertise in this question. _If_ you are actually interensted.
>You think asking whether any 60 year old women are actually readers
Of this specific mangazine, yes. Older women can read whatever they prefer, not questioin here. I just doubt that the % of them reading something like One Piece is very low.
>You’re agreeing and confirming my very points.
No I'm not. That's just your complacency.
They literally where girl friends drawing yaoi dojinshi together. It's pretty common for a group of people with the same hobby to promote their hobby to a business.
Hopefully I don't have to explain why with was a girls-only "club".
The man just died, and your initial reaction is "but his work was male centric". Find a better time.
Appealing to men is okay. Also, there are lots of women that also love and were inspired by Dragon Ball.
Only if you're interpreting my comment to be a criticism . I never used the word "but" nor intended to detract from the significance of his work; it was not suggestion that Toriyama Akira's work could be improved (i.e. by being less male centric).
And no, that was not my initial reaction. If it was, I would have left a top level comment to this end. I did leave a top level comment, recognizing his other work Dragon Quest (since Dragon Ball is already recognized by this HN audience). My comment, again, is a specific nitpicking of OP's claim.
> Appealing to men is okay.
I never said it was not okay.
Why is it bad to have a male centric story? Diversity means that we have some male centric stories, some female centric stories, and some stories with both. You don't "improve" things by making everything more similar, you just remove diversity.
You misread and understand the sentence you quoted.
I am not suggesting being less male centric is an improvement.
A mourning thread is not the place to start arguments about technicalities.
You're right. It was not a criticism nor value judgement of Dragon Ball, Toriyama Akira, nor Japan.
> nitpicking
You're right. It was a semantic nitpicking of OP's claim of universal transcendence.
> A mourning thread is not the place to start arguments about technicalities.
I agree with you in principal, but HN had no qualms starting arguments about technicalities and non-technicalities when it came to other mourning threads. Recently, there was a nobel nominee where more then half the comments were criticism. Things get especially tribal and protectionist whenever Japan and Japanese pop culture is involved.
Here's the thing about nitpicking in a high emotion thread. You have to be completely correct if you don't want to be piled on... and especially here, you aren't.
The OP didn't make a claim of universal transcendence, they listed specific categories (cultures, languages, and generations) that the work transcends. Categories that most works don't transcend. This is inherently praise for the author.
Your bringing up of a separate category that it doesn't transcend when there was no original claim that it transcended this category is either off topic, or a criticism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akira_Toriyama#Style
What he did does not stop the next generation to fight for a more gender equal Japan or the World.
Neither did I.
Respect.
I watched it with french voice over, which were then voiced over by a single polish male dubber with maybe 1-2s delay, so you could hear both languages. Needless to say I didn't speak neither of those, but understood a slight bit polish, and had an absolute blast.
DBZ has special place in my heart. Not so much stuff afterwards, DB itself a bit less, but DBZ hit a proverbial nail on the head (in my head) I didn't even know existed, and it hit it perfectly.
Give it a shot (if you didn't already), worst case you wasted your time with a few EPs.
As a young child, your work made me laugh, gave me guidance on hard work and determination, and was just so damn charming.
It was always a mix of silly vs serious, slice of life vs a potentially hopeless battle. But it was always filled with hope.
May you rest in heaven, together with Hiromi Tsuru (the voice actress for Bulma). If I could wish you back, I would.
If this post somehow manages to get 9000 upvotes, some of us will smile quite a bit.
Like many others, DBZ was the first anime I watched. What an experience trying to get the pirated copies and watch them on RealPlayer. And we'd share fan AMVs like they were secret religious texts at school.
Good times were had.
The man was a legend, from Dragon Ball, Dragon Quest, Chrono Trigger, Dr. Slump and so much more.
He help popularize and normalize anime outside of Japan for so many of us.
RIP