Us Britons have managed to cause some remarkably odd outcomes, way beyond the usual Empire bollocks and this is an absolute belter.
Welsh is a Brythonic language, which is the most common class of languages spoken across what is now the UK(ish) that predates the Roman invasion in 55/54BC and 43 AD. It's way older than English. Other living examples include Scottish, Irish, Cornish (revived) and Bretton (off of France). There are, of course, dialects and so on.
I think it is absolutely delightful that a small part of Patagonia speaks Welsh. In a world hell bent on painting itself beige this is a lovely thing. Diversity is important in all walks of life.
What does it mean for one language to be older than another? They are both Indo-European languages, so they are descended from a common ancestor and have each been continually evolving since then.
My father grew up speaking Welsh at home. Years later, on a family holiday to Brittany, we heard some local old men speaking Breton. My dad was able to understand much of what they were saying. I had never realised the languages were that close.
If we all spoke the same language - say French (lingua Franca) - then we might all think the same way too and the (human) world would soon become beige. I'm not knocking French but English is often known as a lingua franca - a description of English, in Latin about the language of the Franks - or as we now describe it: French!
I think diversity is always indicated as a positive force in all walks of life. It might not be the easiest path. I might have some issues with monotheism vs polytheism or even theism entirely as a counter arguement 8)
Christianity has a Biblically documented myth about a Tower of Babel - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_of_Babel. Well, that bit of Genesis has a slightly different axe to grind to mine.
I've heard that before about thinking but can you give an example of how French speakers think differently from English speakers because of their language? Or any pair of languages for that matter? I would think that language usually follows culture and thinking, adapting to ways of expressing what people want to express rather than driving it.
If anyone is interested Gruf Rhys (from Super Furry Animals) made a film, Separado!, where he tried to track down his Welsh family that migrated to Patagonia.
I've always loved being confounded by unexpected stories like this. 20 years ago, I was working to build a self-publishing company - lulu.com - that would open up the world of book publishing. It was not an easy journey. In 2005 a book was published on the site that told the story of this welsh-patagonian exclave. It sold hundreds of copies in Wales and Argentina. In its narrow space, it was as much a 'bestseller' as anything in the NYTimes, and it was clear that it would never have been published or reached this audience any other way. It was a benediction on our labors.
"William Casnodyn Rhys, a young theology student, dreamed of establishing a Welsh colony where the Welsh language and culture could be preserved...."
I love the Patagonian Welsh. BBC Wales, which often has great comedy, has a sitcom based around the original emigration to Patagonia: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b060cd20
The whole thing feels very much like a Star Trek plot to me with a culture leaving on a ship to an unknown world to preserve their way of life - which later the crew would happen upon in some episode.
Native Welsh speaker here! It has always been a dream of mine to go to Y Wladfa, and share a bond through language with people there.
One fun fact - my dad took some higher-learning Welsh exam as an adult. They had to time the exam to match Patagonia, as they were given the exact same exam to avoid any cheating.
What a nice surprise to find this on HN! I live in Puerto Madryn, the city celebrates its anniversary in honor of the arrival of the first Welsh settlers. Around Chubut, it’s pretty common to see road and tourist signage in Spanish, Welsh, Aoniken and English — especially along Provincial Route 25, which connects the coast to the mountains in the west. It more or less follows the path the welsh took from the Chubut river valley to Esquel and Trevelin.
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[ 3.8 ms ] story [ 42.5 ms ] threadWelsh is a Brythonic language, which is the most common class of languages spoken across what is now the UK(ish) that predates the Roman invasion in 55/54BC and 43 AD. It's way older than English. Other living examples include Scottish, Irish, Cornish (revived) and Bretton (off of France). There are, of course, dialects and so on.
I think it is absolutely delightful that a small part of Patagonia speaks Welsh. In a world hell bent on painting itself beige this is a lovely thing. Diversity is important in all walks of life.
What does it mean for one language to be older than another? They are both Indo-European languages, so they are descended from a common ancestor and have each been continually evolving since then.
English was only established as the British language by Henry VII, so preceding it isn't hard.
I think diversity is always indicated as a positive force in all walks of life. It might not be the easiest path. I might have some issues with monotheism vs polytheism or even theism entirely as a counter arguement 8)
Christianity has a Biblically documented myth about a Tower of Babel - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_of_Babel. Well, that bit of Genesis has a slightly different axe to grind to mine.
Edit: I guess it’s because of the mobile URL…?
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1505405/
"William Casnodyn Rhys, a young theology student, dreamed of establishing a Welsh colony where the Welsh language and culture could be preserved...."
https://www.lulu.com/shop/william-casnodyn-rhys/a-welsh-song...
The whole thing feels very much like a Star Trek plot to me with a culture leaving on a ship to an unknown world to preserve their way of life - which later the crew would happen upon in some episode.
One fun fact - my dad took some higher-learning Welsh exam as an adult. They had to time the exam to match Patagonia, as they were given the exact same exam to avoid any cheating.