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The one thing that prevents me from switching to Firefox is the spell checker. Like many non-native English people, I'm constantly switching between languages when typing. Chrome is smart with that, and detects the right language sentence per sentence. Is there a way to have FF do this? Did I miss something?
I'm assuming Chrome is reporting back to Google everything you're typing. Privacy is probably what's holding Firefox back.
In Chrome you can choose if you want to use an offline or online spellcheck. Offline is on by default.
Similarly, the auto-translate (which Firefox is finally getting) is insanely useful if you ever browse a website that isn’t in a language you can read. I’d be interested in how both features can be implemented in a privacy-preserving way.
No. Default is Hunspell based offline spell checkers, since the beginning of Chrome.
It seems there are add-ons for this :-)

https://github.com/kimsey0/FirefoxAutoDict

This is the kind of thing that should be built-in instead of Monitor, Pocket, etc. :(
They help pay the bills, so I don't mind addons like pocket even if I don't use it.
as an english only speaker I have no need for a feature like this to be built in. I get much more out of monitor. So perhaps neither should be built in by default?
I installed it, but this should be solved at the native level and not on JS.
What difference does it make?
One aspect is having to maintain double dictionaries. Back in the early Mac OS X days the system-wide dictionary was one of the little features that made me happy.
extensions are one lump sum offer away from becoming malware

e: immaigne people down-voting facts https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/-particle-chr...

The same is true of Firefox itself, or indeed any piece of software.
holy false equivalence batman. it's definitely harder to buy/compromise firefox
Yes, that's true, but it would be correspondingly more difficult to find an alternative. If a plugin is compromised you're much more likely to be able to easily find an alternative. So it's a trade-off either way.
the cost of a compromised plugin is not just the inconvenience, but also all the passwords you might enter on forms if the plugin has full permissions granted
That's a stretch. We're talking about a translation plugin here. If FF doesn't have a mechanism to keep passwords safe from that, then that is the problem, not the lack of native translation.
if a plugin can read what's in a field, it can read the passwords therein, I'm not talking about the password file.
I am not wise in the ways of Firefox plugins, but if the ability of a plugin to read a password field is not a separate permission, then that is a much more serious problem than the lack of native translation. That's just a huge gaping security hole, full stop. If that is indeed how Firefox is designed, then the lack of native translation should be the least of your concerns.
> I am not wise in the ways of Firefox plugins

> That's just a huge gaping security hole

> If that is indeed how Firefox is designed

that's the whole point I'm trying to make! goddamit stop working on assumption and hypothetical thinking I'm a lunatic, this is a real issue and the actual way firefox works, how do you think all password manager work?

here look yourself https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/permission-request-mess...

and guess what permission the language extension need?

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-spe...

Go back to this ancestor comment in this thread:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21323832

We're not talking about password managers here, we're talking about spelling checkers. If a spelling checker can read passwords, then Firefox has a problem that that has nothing to do with spelling checkers or password managers. You cannot safely use any plugin.

Now, it's possible that Firefox does indeed have this very serious problem, I don't know. But I think it's much more likely that the FF engineers did the obvious thing and excluded password fields from being accessed by plugins by default if they can access text fields. If this were not the case, the complaint would not have been, "FF doesn't have native spell checking", the complaint would have been, "FF has this gaping security hole through which you can drive an M1 Abrams tank."

good thing then that I linked you to the very spell checker parent included to show you that it's flagged with that goddamn permission I'll put it here as well since you have missed it > https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-spe...

you're not listening and you're having a very strong opinion on a topic you don't know about, which makes having a discussion frustrating, tedious and very unhackernews-like, the data is before your eyes, believe what you will.

but if you are unwilling to listen, then why ask and answer?

> that goddamn permission

What permission is that? The only permission I see is "Access your data for all websites." If that includes passwords, then FF has much bigger problems than not having native spell checking.

Its true of things beyond software too. The problem is the power of people to produce large enough lump sums.
There's slight difference in that in Firefox's case tech journals will be writing about it, everyone else will be talking about it and it will be on front page of HN. In the case of random extension going rogue it will likely get unnoticed for years and when it is finally noticed there's a small chance it will be picked by HN if planets align.
Maybe. Take a look at my exchange with u/LoSboccacc a parallel branch of this thread. If what he claims is correct (I don't know, but he seems pretty confident) then there is already a huge gaping security hole in FF that no one is talking about (AFAICT).
not only is factual, it comes with linked sources for all the claimed points

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21336440

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

Yes, the text on that page can be interpreted as supporting your position. Still, "Offer a password manager..." is not quite the same thing as "silently read all of your passwords and do whatever the extension wants with them..." I have a very hard time believing that the latter is the case and that no one has sounded the alarm on this yet.

Also, add-ons have been deprecated in favor of extensions.

not a great solution but dictionaries are simple files and you can merge them into the one you consider to be your main language
Well, I mean, "do" is an English word, "de" is an Esperanto word and "di" is an Indonesian word. I'd rather they get marked as wrong in the wrong language. (If I'm mixing languages, which I do on my phone often enough in text messages, whatever; but then I don't care about spelling anyway.)
Please vote and/or speak up (constructively, no "mee too" comments please) on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=69687
> Opened 19 years ago

Edit: I commented on Bugzilla I hope everyone does the same.

Go ahead and vote if you wish, but please do not add “me too” comments to our bug tracker.
Thanks for the reminder. I edited my above message to reflect the same sentiment.
LOL forever @ "opened 19 years ago"
Yes that's probably the most annoying thing in FF. Chrome does spell checking even when you mix multiple languages in the same sentence.
Weird, Chrome (specifically Electron) always gets confused when I speak English and Spanish all at once and Slack just starts to say everything I spell in English is wrong, it kinda annoys me. I don't think I have experienced this on Firefox.
Whether it is on Chrome, Firefox, Android or in my text editor, I'll always disable spell checking. I am also not a native english speaker and seeing those red underlines everywhere is just way too annoying for me.
Honest question, where does one use a spellchecker in the browser ?
All text-based input fields. Like this text-area element I am typing in now. But also for elements with the contentEditable attribute set to true.

This is one of the features I appreciate a lot. I am not a native speaker of the English language, and I sometimes mix British English and USA English, and the spell-checker helps me to write consistently better messages.

Thank you for the explanation!

I myself (not a native speaker) am very pedantic about setting all my software to enUS and turn all spell checking off. (I can't even stand the linter underline in VS for example, it ruins my focus, especially when it underlines as I type and then lags before disappearing at the end of the word)

The only place where I use spellcheck is e-mail at work to avoid typos. Over the years I've learned to proofread my messages before sending them and touch typing helps a ton as well.

In the textarea where you just entered your question...
Not mentioned in this article (although it's in the Release Notes [1]): the amazing work done regarding the macOS compositor.

This should give pretty noticeable speed and battery improvements on Retina Macbooks.

[1] https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/70.0/releasenotes/#new

Game changer! Now from my POV Firefox is the best desktop browser, period. No caveats.
Is there a good transition path for someone who uses a lot of Google products? In particular, I use Chrome across all my devices, and I depend on the ability to search my history/recent tabs/etc from anywhere. Will Firefox give me the same ability? Is the transition literally just: Install Firefox everywhere and start using it instead?
Firefox Sync let's you syncronize Bookmarks, Open tabs, Logins, History, Add-ons and Preferences across devices by logging in once with username password
Couple of questions about this: does FF import Chrome logins? Also, can Mozilla read the data or are they doing client-side-encryption?
Can each of those be turned on or off per device, and dont get sneakily turned back on during upgrades?
edit: Sorry for anyone I misled. You can't opt a particular kind of data out of syncing per device. You can only enable/disable for the whole account.

Yes, each (bookmarks, history, passwords, tabs ) can be turned on or off per device basis.

This is incorrect AFAIK. The sync toggle for a data type is for the whole account, not per-device.
You are right. Always thought it worked like that but indeed it is for the whole account and not per device. My bad.
Here’s the Sync security FAQ to answer javajosh’s follow up question, which I can’t reply to directly.

“How Firefox Sync keeps your data safe even if TLS fails” https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/how-firefox-sync-keeps-...

If you click on the 'x hours ago' part of the comment next to the username you will get a parent link and can then reply to and save individual comments.
Pretty much, yes. You’ll have to make a Firefox account, but then tabs and plugins will sync everywhere you log in.
As long as you use it everywhere in the same way you presently use Chrome everywhere, yes. You can also import a certain amount (history & bookmarks, not, I think, current & recent tabs) to get started.
> Is the transition literally just: Install Firefox everywhere and start using it instead?

Yep. I did this about a year ago. You have to create a Mozilla account (if you haven't already) in order to sync your tabs and history across devices, but that should be a given.

I find the Firefox sync a bit clunky compared to Chromes though. I think Chrome sends udpates to Google on each change whereas Firefox polls and updates on a schedule which means sometimes if you put a device to sleep (or if you're on iOS and the app gets suspended) your history and tab state won't be propagated and it'll be missing on your other devices which can be frustrating when you're away from those devices.

> Will Firefox give me the same ability?

Yes.

> transition literally just: Install Firefox everywhere and start using it instead?

Almost. You will have to create a firefox account and export/import your bookmarks. That's it.

Agreed to what everyone else said, but to me the killer feature of Firefox Sync is that you can send tabs from one browser to another, so I can find links on my work computer and ship them directly to my home computer or phone to read later, and they'll just show up when it syncs next.
I'm actually not sure if this is a native Chrome feature, but I can instantly send tabs to my other devices with right click > "send to your devices" > list of devices with a Google account signed in (Which is my phone and laptop for me on my desktop).
I'm doing this but it's painful. I am still stuck on GMail.
The performance is what has kept me on Chrome on Mac. Going to re-install FF now and give it a whirl. Thanks for this info!
I just tried this. Interestingly I'd left it on v68 and it cooked my MBP, fans all on max immediately. When I updated to 70 it seems to work perfectly. CPU temp in the 40s. Gonna leave it on in the background and see if it suddenly spikes.
The same here. Have you tried with FF add-ons that normally are the culprit for CPU hogging?
Yeah, they're all on. Seems to be fine thus far, and there's an article about what they actually did to fix it, so I'm ready to say it's fixed.

Only minor gripe is userChrome.css seems to not be used now.

You need to enable it in about:config

Set this option to true: toolkit.legacyUserProfileCustomizations.stylesheets

Was set to true already.
Was it referring to browser.xul? There’s no XUL left, so you might need to change that to browser.xhtml.
That's a slightly worrying precedent, they're calling the way to diaable certain bits of obnoxiousness (the header bar in Tree Style Tabs comes to mind) "legacy", which is usually a precursor to removal.

Is there a new method available/forthcoming, or is this more control planned to be wrenched out of user's hands?

You can also use Brave browser, it's basically Chrome with the ad tracking removed. With that, almost no reason to switch to another browser.
Brave looks amazing, the question I have is, just like how Google Chrome, can they be trusted as a private entity?
Well, they're shilling their own worthless cryptocurrency, so it is obvious to me that they cannot be.
It is an opt-in system. They're not making you use it and you don't lose anything by choosing not to opt-in. What exactly are they doing that you would consider "shilling"?

https://brave.com/brave-rewards/

What would you call creating a new alt-coin and implying it will some day have value?

That entire industry is a dumpster fire of greed, fraud, and misrepresentation.

A good chunk of HN is really fed up with cryptocurrencies.

Whoever are pushing them - including Telegram that I otherwise like - are damaging their reputation in my eyes.

Interesting. Any downside of Brave? Small userbase, etc ?
I use it in my Android, because it allows me to have an ad blocking browser without rooting and without installing any additional software.

My gripe there is that it started showing push notifications of ads!!! Once I blocked all its notifications everything went to normality.

This would be a showstopper for me. Turning off the notifications addresses only part of the issue, I would never trust them again.

Why not use Firefox?

>injects own custom http headers so advertisers can uniquely identify you even easier

>takes crypto donation hostage and opens funds in other people's names (i.e. scams crypto to artificially create demand for that BAT)

If you use Brave you literally are part of the problem.

You’re still contributing to the Chromium engine monoculture, though.
Guess we are dealing with purists here. Mind you that Chromium is free and open-source just like MySQL. A strategical move by the community to fork MySQL to MariaDB to ensure it remained free and open from the tech giant after it was acquired by Oracle. How Brave is any different? It made a similar move. Some people hate crypto. Fine. Personally I've never used the Brave crypto. Perhaps FF 70 has completely fixed its performance problem, sure, happy to switch. But before that really happens Brave is still a viable interim solution.
The issue is the engine. There are few big engines out there and chromium is taking a lot of the market.

The issue with this is that they could start controlling the standards and everyone would have to follow behind instead of everyone working and doing what’s best for consumers.

While chromium is open source, that doesn’t mean they have to accept merges from the community. It only means that they have to provide the source code. Yes it can be forked, but now you have to maintain or develop your engine. If they’re the dominant ones and are setting standards, that won’t help much.

By using another one you are helping keep a neutral ground.

The difference between MySQL and MariaDB is that you have PostgreSQL, Oracle, SQLite, MSSQL among a bunch of others, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_relational_datab...

So the issue isn’t forking or not, but the fact that it’s still close enough that gives chromium the competitive edge and could kill the market.

Would this bring it up to par with safari's power consumption?
I don't know about other usages, but energy consumption while using YouTube is important to me (usually have something playing while I work) so I just did a quick measurement.

Safari 13.0.2 versus Firefox 70.0 versus Chrome 77.0

Playing the same YouTube video at the same quality (1080p) and watching Energy Impact in Activity Monitor while the video played, I saw averages of: Safari used 20, Firefox used 45, Chrome used 45.

So on that task at least Safari is still king, but Firefox is on par with Chrome.

I just checked with the Intel Power Gadget on a 2015 MBP 10.14.6, iGPU only, same video at 1080p, package power consumption (CPU + iGPU):

~6,4W average in Safari 13.0.3

~8,6W average in Firefox 70

Safari still uses significantly less CPU while decoding video.
Also from the Q&A at the end:

> Safari’s compositor is entirely Core Animation based; Safari basically skips step 2.

(Step 2 is "the Firefox “compositor” assembles Gecko layers to produce the rendering of the window")

You think this affects video decoding?

Anyway, I imagine that's the price to pay for being crossplatform. You can't implement everything for every platform. Safari only has to work on macOS/iOS.

> You think this affects video decoding?

Speaking for Chrome's implementation, efficiently rendering video on macOS does require CALayer compositing, but it's not sufficient.

Only certain types of decoded frames can be efficiently scanned out (different from the types that can be used efficiently in OpenGL compositing). Actually entering the most efficient fullscreen video mode requires some magic. Matching macOS behavior exactly when a fallback to OpenGL compositing is required can be difficult (eg. colorspace bugs can result in flickering).

I have not looked at the new code in Firefox, but I would expect that not all of the benefit would be realized in a first release. In any case it's a huge undertaking to support a single platform; congrats to the team for making it happen!

Safari does not support vp8 or vp9 when playing youtube, and youtube serves h264 instead. h264 is less efficient in terms of compression ratio (more to download for the same quality), but h264 is decoded in hardware on OSX, and VP8 or VP9 isn't, which explains what you see.

This is why, for example, Safari does not have 4k video on Youtube, while being perfectly capable of playing 4k videos in general.

Depending on the machine, VP9 can be decoded in hardware on Firefox on Windows, but chip support is limited.

All that said, we're working on our video playback performance as we speak, especially on OSX (because it was so bad a few release back), but also in general.

Thanks for the explanation.

I found this extension that forces FF to use H264 instead: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/h264ify/

On my old MBP I'd rather consume more bandwidth than more more CPU.

Thanks for the link. On Firefox/Linux nvidia drivers, I don't see much difference in h264 vs VP9
We don't do hardware decoding on Linux for now, because we don't do hardware acceleration for graphics by default on Linux.

Web Render might allow doing it properly, since the rendering is not on the CPU anymore.

Maybe just don't watch videos inside your Browser. You know there's youtube-dl+mpv?
iina can ply youtube stream without pre-downloading them. You have also Picture in Picture following you on all desktop.

iina is open source and have a lot of codec available.

I don't know if it change something on energy consumption, though.

I don't know what iina is, but youtube-dl + mpv mentioned by Angeo34 does exactly that (stream videos without pre-downloading them). Youtube-dl just gets the stream URL and mpv plays it. And it's easy to use, just:

    mpv https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
This should be the headline feature. I've been following this bug for so long on Bugzilla. The energy improvement is really incredible.
Battery life is my primary concern, and unless they release battery life benchmarks I’d be hard pressed to switch off of Safari.
Yeah, I just switched to Safari recently because of battery life
Last I checked it was looking like they would now be as "good" as Chrome, which is much worse than Safari. Hopefully that improved or will soon improve.
Recently switched from Safari to Firefox because of the awful extensions environment in Safari but definitely missing the battery life. Really wish one browser could just get everything right
Safari means no ublock, the web without is annoying.
FWIW, I started using 1Blocker recently with Safari and have found it to be quite good. YMMV.
Disconnect works well enough.
There are other options (paid ones) that are equal —or even better since they are quite automatic— than ublock.

The only two things I'm missing in safari to be hones are:

- A no-script extension or similar.

- Sync part of my work is on a no macOS machines I don't have safari there, so no sync. I partially overcome this with bookmaster for bookmarks, but I still missing tabs and read it later list. However, firefox doesn't have this later feature on desktop —and I don't why.

Firefox Sync syncs your tabs, bookmarks, passwords, etc. Your read it later list is synced through Pocket (which is owned by Mozilla). They exist on desktop and mobile.
Still using pinboard; one of the best investment I made in my entire life.
does anybody know if all of these are available in nightly?
Yes, Nightly is (I'm simplifying a bit but it's generally true) release + a few weeks of patches + different default settings, sometimes experimental things enabled, etc.

I'm running Nightly on OSX and I confirm all those improvements are there, but more are coming.

Trying it out and it absolutely flies!!
This is what I am most excited about. I have been using the improvements through nightly since they were released, I think little more than a month, and I couldn't be happier. I'd hate to have to use Chrome and I welcome the competition to webkit.
After years of waiting, it's hard to believe it's finally fixed. Will try this out immediately.
i am very very eager to test and use this. FF is my main driver but it's a heat machine on my mac 10.11.6. I wonder if i gain something to upgrade my macOS (4g ram :()
anyone knows how firefox is on iOS? vs Safari/Chrome? :) Want to switch, but wondering whether it's worth it cross-platform
Should this affect memory bloat? Because I still have to restart ffx regularly on my Mac because it uses upward of 8gb RAM over time
Love Firefox. The philosophy, its snappiness, its many add-ons, the UI. - Glad to have an alternative to Chrome! Keep up the good work, Mozilla & Firefox team.
Glad to have an alternative to Chrome!

Many would argue that Chrome is an alternative to Firefox, given that Firefox predates Chrome as the first real viable browser alternative.

Historically, yes, that's true. But these days Chrome has a huge lead in the market compared to every other browser, so FF is the alternative again.
It's almost like a massive evil corporation is leveraging monopoly status in other areas to push their web browser.

History sure does rhyme.

Of course this time the monopolists are also funding their "competition" in exchange for market share protection in other areas. So that's new.

Compared to current Chromium based browsers (I'm using Edge/ium), how does this Firefox release's DevTools compare?
I feel like the websocket inspector was the last thing I was missing, and now that I have it, I only need chrome for compatibility checks.
Day to day tasks like browsing the DOM, debug, networking, are top notch in both Chrome and FF, haven't found anything infuriating in FF devtools, they are very serious in having snappy and useful experience.
Recently switched my work (full stack web) Macbook to Firefox and I'm pleasantly surprised by how capable FF's dev-tools are compared to Chrome. I was expecting it to be a much more difficult transition. Still running Chrome on an iMac at home (we use a lot of Chromecast there, so I imagine switching will be a bit more painful) but would like to divest from Google where reasonable.
I do a moderate amount of ReactJS dev, and FF has been excellent. I barely noticed the transition from Chrome to FF when it came to my workflows.
Does anyone know of what useful/killer features chrome dev tools have that ff doesn't? I switched to ff full time a few years ago and only open chrome for testing sites. The only thing I notice is that they have slightly different habits as to where they jump in the html when you are using the inspect feature. The only killer Firefox "feature" I can think of is an extension which is much more recent -- eval villain (https://www.hurricanelabs.com/blog/making-easy-dom-xss-actua...).
One feature that FF has and Chrome doesn't, is the abiliy to edit and reset an http request.
My experience is that Chromium DevTools are much more polished than Firefox's. For instance, the network tab is a pain to use with FF on a small screen because the columns have a large default width, so the Method column ("GET") is as large as the URL path column. And you can't resize them. Chromium has a better default, and I can resize them. If I view the detail of a request, pressing Esc will close the details view in Chromium, while it will toggle the console in FF. Even with the mouse, at first I struggled to find how to close the details with FF (the toggling icon is not part of the toggled window, it's next to the filter field!).
> And you can't resize them.

You can resize them nowadays.

Some of those updates are to catch up to Chrome's developer tools. If I were in charge of Firefox, I would honestly have them hire a developer or two to focus solely on the Developer Tools. I'm sure there's many things that browser developer tools could do that we have not even scratched the surface of. I prefer Firefox overall, only use Chrome due to manager only looking at my work on Chrome (it will be deployed in a WebKit container). The DOM Breakpoint feature is one I found out this week about in Chrome, glad it's now in Firefox.
Firefox has an entire team dedicated to developer tools, fwiw. I'm not sure whether your suggestion was "one or two more, in addition to the 7 or 8 already working on it", or "one or two more, instead of the 0 working on it now"...
I'd happily add more people to the mix yeah, had no concept of how many were working on it currently though, I assumed some people worked on it but not dedicated. As I wrote my comment I realized that kind of tooling is not necessarily easy to work on potentially.
They spent the past few years rewriting them to allow them to build on it more quickly and encourage outside contributions. They finished that a while ago and have been ramping up new features quickly, and some exciting things are coming. For example: https://gist.github.com/jasonLaster/1e220992c294a571dd9b59ab...
Woah! Awesome! If I remember correctly the formal name for this is "Event Sourcing."
It has the features that Chrome has but the UI and performance is worse.
Wow, blown away by how much better the new password manager is! If they add support for custom fields on each login, this could almost completely replace my need for a 3rd party solution.
Couple other features I'd like: - Import from other formats (Keepass, or at least any format Keepass can export to) - Share items with someone else
I'm blown away that there's no import yet. How else am I going to switch from another password manager?

I also saw a comment from the dev team that they're "aware" of the need for such a feature but it's not on a road map yet.

Agreed. I'm thinking of cancelling my Dashlane subscription and moving to this Password Manager now.

Firefox's Lockwise App (on android) leaves a lot demanding though.

Wow, a subscription password manager.
This is wonderful. I wish they would make Pocket a little less terrible (no forced reader mode for links, etc)
Don't you still use a 3rd party solution for app logins on your phone?
Can't speak for Android, but for iOS Firefox has an app which does all the proper hooking into system autofill to be able to fill your passwords browsers/apps.

(There's an Android app, too. I'm just not familiar with Android's affordances for that sort of thing so I can't really comment on how it works.)

https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/lockwise/

Then what happens when you're on a different browser?
So when some Firefox tab gets owned by some Javascript exploit, does that mean its integrated password manager could be compromised too?
With a previous update 1-2 years ago, the password manager seemed to lose the ability to force-create and edit new items, which is necessary if you are using it as a general purpose password manager, or for sites that stubbornly refused to play nice. I switched to LastPass, which worked out fairly well, with the family option, so that my spouse and I can share subsets of passwords with each other. But this FF update does look like they've fixed that issue.
Does it only support passwords? I actually use 1Password for quite a bit of information. (Credit cards, bank accounts, email accounts, servers, and random memberships)
I will always use a 3rd party password solution since it prevents browser lock-in.
That's one of my reasons too, I use Safari on iPhone and iPad, and FireFox on my desktop. It's great to just be able to use 1Password everywhere.
personally im trying to move away from keeping everything in one basket but maybe there is some benefit to having a password manager built in vs a 3rd party extension? less attack area?

earlier in this year I switched from bitwarden (which I would still recommend) to keepass because I wanted to fill desktop passwords... but there is the added benefit that you actually don't need a browser extension if you don't want to. instead ive been using the autotype feature that can be run from a hotkey.

I would have wished a world where both the chromium project and Mozilla would collaborate to a unified JS compiler instead of having two separate implementations. How faster would have JS been? How more featureful and less buggy?

BTW chrome 78 will be released today too!

But without their own js compiler, chrome couldn't randomly add/deprecate features! It's not like Mozilla existed first and was open source back when Chrome launched. Oh wait, it was open sourced 10 years before Chrome launched! So yeah, I blame greed.

https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/history/

On the contrary, I'd say that competition has been good for all involved. For such a maligned language that was born in a little over a week, JavaScript is better and faster than it has any right to be.

The amount of resources that have gone into improving JavaScript is amazing. I just wonder what some other languages would look like now with that kind of attention.

Only a week? And I would slap python 3 right on top of that. Despite the language being inherently messy and fully dynamic (similar to js), there are tons of static analysis tools, compilers, alternate run times, IDEs, etc.

Edit: the "only a week?" question was genuine, it wasn't meant to be tongue in cheek.

"There was a lot of internal pressure to pick one language as soon as possible. Python, Tcl, Scheme itself were all possible candidates. So Eich had to work fast. He had two advantages over the alternatives: freedom to pick the right set of features, and a direct line to those who made the calls. Unfortunately, he also had a big disadvantage: no time. Lots of important decisions had to be made and very little time was available to make them. JavaScript, a.k.a. Mocha, was born in this context. In a matter of weeks a working prototype was functional, and so it was integrated into Netscape Communicator."

https://auth0.com/blog/a-brief-history-of-javascript/

Looks like it was pretty quick but maybe not just one week. Looks like Python was actually considered, but bear in mind that this was 25 years ago. Python 3 certainly wasn't out yet and the available tool ecosystem was much more limited.

Do some elementary, Wikipedia-level research — Python was at 1.3 then if I recall correctly. As I’ve written many times, the management order was “make it look like Java”, so none of the languages you mentioned was practical. None was practical anyway in terms of portability and safety from Windows 3.1 to Mac CodeWarrior to a number of Unixes that still mattered to Netscape sales. See/hear also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1905155. See also https://devchat.tv/js-jabber/124-jsj-the-origin-of-javascrip... — transcript below the fold.
Speaking as a member of one of the many W3C working groups, I would say that it isn't desirable. When designing a standard, we want to have multiple competing implementations of the standard to ensure it is well defined and understood by users.

Should there be one implementation, we wouldn't be able to say with confidence that we have succeeded for that goal.

Your argument is moot, nothing prevent V8 to make two competitive implementations of a feature. With mozilla ressources focused on not duplicating effort, they would even have resources for making 3 or 4 compretitive implementations per JS proposals.
I wonder, why they implemented Baseline JS interpreter in C++? Why not Rust?
Because the interpreter pipeline shares code and data structures [0]: a couple of examples from the link below:

> The Baseline Interpreter uses the same frame layout as the Baseline JIT, but we’ve added some interpreter-specific fields to the frame.

> Because the Baseline Interpreter and JIT are so similar, a lot of the code generation code can be shared too. To do this, we added a templated BaselineCodeGen base class with two derived classes: - BaselineCompiler: used by the Baseline JIT to compile a script’s bytecode to machine code. - BaselineInterpreterGenerator: used to generate the Baseline Interpreter code.

[0] https://hacks.mozilla.org/2019/08/the-baseline-interpreter-a...

I believe the Rust rewrite of parts is proceeding, but this tech blog explains what's going on: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2019/08/the-baseline-interpreter-a...

> The Baseline Interpreter sits between the C++ interpreter and the Baseline JIT and has elements from both. It executes all bytecode instructions with a fixed interpreter loop (like the C++ interpreter). In addition, it uses Inline Caches to improve performance and collect type information (like the Baseline JIT).

Including elements [of code] from both would be considerably harder in another language.

If you read closely it appears the interpreter is "generated" - that it, it's not written directly in C++ or anything at all, but is instead an interpreter emitted by the JIT compiler!

I was under the impression that this was a side goal of the servo project. Of course now it looks like it is it's own thing: https://servo.org/

Does anyone know if servo is supposed to be related to Firefox in some way, or if it is always meant to be independent?

I noticed that firefox (dev edition) got rid of possibility to disable update notifications. I prefer my browser to be updated from repository rather than by itself. Did anyone has the same issue or found some workaround?
Surely if your package manager installs firefox into /usr or whatever, it's not gonna be able to update itself either way, right?
Yes, distributes packages work differently.
Wow. With attitudes like this:

"The discussion about the method for disabling updates has been had over and over already, there is nothing left to say about it, and the change will not be reverted. You've been given workarounds for your problem. Please do not reopen this bug or file any others asking the same thing."

... who needs Microsoft?

> Firefox 70 introduces three new properties related to text decoration/underline:

> text-decoration-thickness: sets the thickness of lines added via text-decoration.

> text-underline-offset: sets the distance between a text decoration and the text it is set on. Bear in mind that this only works on underlines.

> text-decoration-skip-ink: sets whether underlines and overlines are drawn if they cross descenders and ascenders. The default value, auto, causes them to only be drawn where they do not cross over a glyph. To allow underlines to cross glyphs, set the value to none.

I'm so excited for these. Implementing sane underlines for headers has been a pain in the ass for far too long. Writers rejoice!

Don't want to rain on your parade, but this is a long way from being generally available: https://caniuse.com/#search=text-decoration-thickness

11% coverage, and almost all of that is iOS Safari.

This is one of these cases though, were coverage doesn't really matter. The fall-back is fairly reasonable.
That's true, but if I used all CSS properties with this amount of coverage it would cause a lot of extra work for very little gain. If this is something that really gets your goat, and you use Firefox, perhaps it's worth it to scratch the itch, but otherwise pretty useless currently.
But if you'd otherwise use border-bottom hacks, this is a good reason to stop doing those and just have Chrome users live with the not-terrible default underline until Chrome supports those properties as well.
Me too -- This is a real quality of life improvement for developers that work with picky designers :)
It'll be nice to simplify underline links tremendously once that becomes implemented in IE/Edge & Safari. The existing methods for avoiding underlines overlapping text descenders like Tufte-CSS's method (https://github.com/edwardtufte/tufte-css) are kinda crazy looking, and also cause the occasional bug with text highlighting.
Do people actually want it? Technological limitation or not, this is how things have been both in print and digital for as long as I can remember. Not to mention handwriting. I still find the non-overlapping underline weird (even if kind of neat).
I think people do; it's popular enough that many people implement it, not just Tufte-CSS, it was one of the first things I added to gwern.net once I saw it demoed, I believe Medium also does it, and no one's complained to me that they really like the overlapping obscuration.
I really like the overlapping underline. Well, really I like the non-broken underline, which happens to overlap with descenders.

If the underline indicating a link breaks, it looks like there are two adjacent links. To check if this is the case, I have to mouseover both the link before and after the break, and compare the URLs with my eyes.

I find this a much greater annoyance then I do the overlapping underlining.

>If the underline indicating a link breaks, it looks like there are two adjacent links

Ah that's what that is. I've seen a few like that and wondered why there were two identical links next to each other not thinking it was underline style.

I'll save myself the hover now!

Wikipedia also does it, I just noticed.
I wonder if the default values for offset and thickness will respect those declared in the font. And also whether sub-pixel values are allowed? I don’t know how many fonts declare these values, but it would be a shame not to use information that provides values tailored to the font in use.
Firefox has always* respected the underline position/thickness in the font. This is why in an example like

    data:text/html,<u style="font:99px times">Times</u> <u style="font:99px Arial">Arial
the Times and Arial elements get different underlines.

(Safari and Chrome don't do this, they ignore the font's properties and use an arbitrary underline of their own -- which differs between the two, Chrome's being somewhat thicker.)

* "Always" may not be strictly true, but it's certainly been a long time.

That’s great to hear. I had assumed otherwise because of the other browsers lack of support.
Does anyone know how Firefox Lockwise compares to other password managers? For example, can it store additional notes next to the password?
It does not allow notes, only login/password.

I use it to sync passwords with my phone. I like that I can use a fingerprint to unlock the file on my phone (instead of passphrase). I used to put silly passwords on sites I didn't care about (variants on a common password), but now I systematically generate a random password for all sites because there is no loss of convenience.

> Pause on DOM Mutation in Debugger

Heckin finally!

The dev tool improvements all seem good. Still no support for inline code edits, which means JS debugging will still be something of a pain, but strengthening Firefox's position as one of the better tools for debugging and prototyping CSS.

Saw that too. What a wicked feature. Will make reverse engineering and debugging other peoples code much much easier!
> Web socket inspector - In Firefox DevEdition, the Network monitor now has a new “Messages” panel, which appears when you are monitoring a web socket connection (i.e. a 101 response)

Yay, this is great news. Thanks guys! Nice to not have to revert to Chrome for websocket debugging.

It will be interesting to see in the report which trackers sneak past my uMatrix rules. :)
Permission requests can no longer be made while in fullscreen mode

This is great news. What a huge security hole that has been.

So happy that Firefox is making steady progress.

I’m surprised though to see new CSS features so prominently in the announcement. Doesn’t this add unwanted additional fragmentation to browser CSS support?

A cosmetic feature like that naively seems better implemented with a library rather than folding it straight into one particular browser, but maybe I’m witnessing the process of text-underline-thickness being cemented in the standard after years of such library-based support?

New version gives SSL_ERROR_UNKNOWN_CA_ALERT on my client certs. Guess I have to go back to Chrome now...
Just import your CA
It's already installed, that's not it.
Does FF use a different cert-store than os? I've frequently had to fiddle with os/app cert-stores to get them to trust. Not just import the cert but the signer too, some times on both sides. I'll likely hit this issue when I upgrade.
It does have it's own cert store. You can test your sites with testssl.sh [1] to see if they validate correctly. It only depends on openssl and bash. If you have your own self signed CA/certs, then you would have to import them into FF.

[1] - https://github.com/drwetter/testssl.sh

Turns out this was an issue with Firefox's automatic certificate selection logic. I changed it to ask me every time instead of automatically selecting certs, and once it saves my selection it's back to normal. I'm not sure how that changed in this release, but it's at least resolvable.
I recently switched to firefox to give it a try. Does anyone else 2x-3x their video playback and notice the audio distortion in FF on mac? I've tried to find some discussion or workarounds for it, but no dice. Hoping that maybe the renderer in this release might help a little.
Yes, we (the media team at Mozilla) know about this, and we're having a look.

The algorithm we use it not the best (and I think it's not the only cause of bad quality here), and we're investigating what to do.

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1427267 is where we track this issue.

> Lastly, Core Animation allows us to move rendered content around in the window cheaply. This is great for efficient scrolling. (Our current compositor does not yet make use of this capability, but future work in WebRender will take advantage of it.)

Oh I am so excited about this! Where can I follow along with this development?

I wish they'd add the touchpad back/forward/zoom/scroll gestures in win10. Chrome is just too far ahead when it comes to usability.
This is great news! I tried to switch to firefox to do my (frontend) development in, but I noticed serious slowdowns compared to Chrome with multiple tabs open. Going to give this another try!
Nah. Apple has its own ad budget.
My message to the team would be: Please bring back the shader editor in devtools.

In a previous release, we had access to live reloading shader editor, which was really useful in my case, developing real time WebGL apps. It was a truly nice developer feature.

Finally, numeric separators!
Pinch-to-zooooooooom!!!!!!!!!! Finally. I will definitely try Firefox again for a week or so, and see how it manages, battery-wise, compared to Safari.
I just tried here and it’s not working. Do I need to change any settings?
Pinch-to-zoom is still incomplete on Mac
I don't see any mention of this. I made some about:config changes before and got pinch zoom working on Firefox 68, but it only zooms 10% for each discrete pinch gesture I make. Did they update it to be better than this?
What's the state of saving & autofilling credit card info? That's the one thing that keeps me going back to chrome (rather than typing in my card by hand).

There are some bugs on this that look quite stale, and they don't seem interested in finishing support, and its disabled by default..

It's not on Chrome's level, but it does have autofill. I hope that is next on their agenda. I love how Chrome prompts for security code and generates based on that.

I switched over to FF recently and just use Chrome for password generation, but looks like I can switch for good.