This happens more frequently then one imagines. Quite a few things fail to start from scratch and instead rely on compounded errors over time. Projections, budgets, etc., are sometimes based on stale information.
I did not expect this to just be a simple mistake, especially one that's been around for decades. Makes you wonder what other kind of basic facts are wrong.
In the age of satellites, computers, Google maps and the like you would think a mistake like this would be impossible to persist for so long.
These kinds of issues have existed since the first human started recording what they owned, and will probably continue plaguing us until the last one dies.
A bunch of countries are suspected of undercounting their population because so many people are living "off the grid" or deliberately overcounting to get more funding. Probably some of the cases are real and some are just conspiracy theories.
What I wonder is why anyone noticed this in the first place. Who saw the size of the country in Wikipedia and thought, “really? Let me trace that in Google maps, just to be sure…”
I actually measured the size of (parts of) Yemen on maps a week or two ago, trying to figure out the population density of the Houthi-controlled areas, which contain the majority (~70-80%, hard to say exactly as the population distribution has been changing rapidly in the past decade) of Yemen's population in about 1/3 of it's land.
Although I do hope too that people don't lose their sense of meaning and curiosity too much, it's worth keeping in mind that this article was published in 2024 which was a very different world from now. Curiosity requires energy, and it'll be hard for a creature relying on energy for survival to justify using their own energy for some activity when there's a more energy-efficient way to reach a specific goal. But just like going to the gym makes your body healthier despite the fact this requires energy, thinking on your own will be increasingly important for maintaining a healthy mind and the sense of self.
this was posted on 27. of november 2024. on the 3rd of december someone found a correct looking number in a yemen government document and updated wikipedia.
Ah I'm glad. That's much better than the solution I had in mind of using the sand from the desert to expand the land into the sea to add extra 100k km of land area, to hide all this embarrassment under the rug.
That would have to be a pretty big rug. I actually know some rug merchants in New York who are having a going-out-of-business sale who might be able to help.
i figured there was some connection, but i didn't expect the author to be involved because i would have expected that they update the article and mention that they found a document and fixed wikipedia.
Well, this is a pretty perfect usecase for AI (although it's also easy to just get shapefiles from NE and do it yourself, obviously).
Interestingly all of UAE, Yemen and Saudi Arabia have significant discrepancies between the World Factbook and their shapefiles (in every case overestimating), probably all related to not having had a demarcated border in the Rub Al Khali.
A quick lazy calculation (including adding in Antartica) the countries totals came up ~2,000,000km2 short. I don't care enough to dive deeper, but if no one is claiming that land I'll happily take it.
I think a more important question is whether Yemen still exists as as single coherent political entity with the same borders as seen on ANY of those maps, which given the present situation, it clearly does not.
Nobody who isn't a Shia Islamist should want them to succeed ("God is the Greatest, Death to America, Death to Israel, Curse the Jews, Victory to Islam").
I did consider writing (Shia) instead of Shia but I still think it is mistake from a long term perspective due to previous history between shia and sunni.
Besides, let's not pretend like Israel isn't a resevoir of hate against arabs and muslims—they are defacto a jewish supremacist state. By any measure that Ansarallah is worth attacking, surely Israel deserves this many times over for acting on their violent bigotry for decades before any of us were born.
> Israel didn't lift a finger to hurt them before they attacked Israel
Israel is genociding Gaza and still killing people and stealing more lands in the West Bank. Under international law, we are required to do whatever necessary to stop a genocide. Unfortunately only Yemen that step up to actually do that. The US and other western countries keep supporting the genocide.
> Ignoring the curse upon Jews and and victory to Islam, how convenient.
Until 90% or more jews condemn Israel like how 90% muslim condemn ISIS, it's a statistically accurate statement.
I can continue for another dozens or hundreds of articles but I suspect you're well aware of our crimes and simply don't care.
I know what imperialism looks like. Maybe we should clean up our own house before bombing and choking out others.There's always time to come clean before God—or if you don't believe in God, at least, before our children.
Let's not pretend the whole world doesn't see Israel dog-walking us like the cowards we are.
I remember hearing from a Yemeni American in the late 90s that the border with Saudi was not defined (mentioned in the article). I wonder if this could be explained more simply that a few sources didn't bother to update this over time due to the ambiguity, they just carried over what had been published before.
A casual review of the satellite view of the border with Saudi Arabia shows that much of it is desolate uninhabited sand dunes, so it's not like there's border markers such as the US/Canada have. Or likely an accurate survey (you'd need high precision GNSS equipment and something that can traverse serious sand dunes as a vehicle, because no fixed markers and traditional surveying methods have any chance of success there).
Historically, borders in inhospitable regions where the government cannot project power used to be vague.
Early Medieval European kingdoms usually had border forests, sometimes quite deep (50-100 km), where one end of the forest was definitely Bohemian and the other end definitely Saxon or Austrian, but the exact demarcation within it bothered no one.
There were only two kinds of people crossing them: invading armies and long-distance traders on very few walkable paths. The latter would be taxed prior to entering the city markets, not on the border. The former would be interested in sieging strongholds deeper in the enemy territory, not in taking a slice of wooded territory on the border.
This reminds me of what Deming used to say: there is no correct value for any measurement, there are only the outcomes of methods chosen to measure something.
Great article. I wonder if the sum of the land areas of all countries on earth matches the global size of emerged land? Or are there other similar errors?
62 comments
[ 0.10 ms ] story [ 85.8 ms ] thread(I suppose people downvoting this don’t know the reference. Way to make us feel old :) )
In the age of satellites, computers, Google maps and the like you would think a mistake like this would be impossible to persist for so long.
(See e.g. The misreporting of statistical results in psychology journals; Bakker, Wicherts; Behaviour Research Methods; 2011.)
They knew the figure was wrong but needed a document with the correct figure they could reference.
Interestingly all of UAE, Yemen and Saudi Arabia have significant discrepancies between the World Factbook and their shapefiles (in every case overestimating), probably all related to not having had a demarcated border in the Rub Al Khali.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_al-Atifi
Israel didn't lift a finger to hurt them before they attacked Israel but nice try to confuse cause and effect.
Do you think Yemenis deserve to choose who their government is?
I didn't swap those, their saying includes both Jews and Israel. What is a certain way, I'm confused.
Besides, let's not pretend like Israel isn't a resevoir of hate against arabs and muslims—they are defacto a jewish supremacist state. By any measure that Ansarallah is worth attacking, surely Israel deserves this many times over for acting on their violent bigotry for decades before any of us were born.
Israel is genociding Gaza and still killing people and stealing more lands in the West Bank. Under international law, we are required to do whatever necessary to stop a genocide. Unfortunately only Yemen that step up to actually do that. The US and other western countries keep supporting the genocide.
> Ignoring the curse upon Jews and and victory to Islam, how convenient.
Until 90% or more jews condemn Israel like how 90% muslim condemn ISIS, it's a statistically accurate statement.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houthis#Human_rights_violation...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Saudi_Arabia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_genocide
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analysis_of_the_2026_Iran_war#...
I can continue for another dozens or hundreds of articles but I suspect you're well aware of our crimes and simply don't care.
I know what imperialism looks like. Maybe we should clean up our own house before bombing and choking out others.There's always time to come clean before God—or if you don't believe in God, at least, before our children.
Let's not pretend the whole world doesn't see Israel dog-walking us like the cowards we are.
EDIT: removed misogynistic wording.
Early Medieval European kingdoms usually had border forests, sometimes quite deep (50-100 km), where one end of the forest was definitely Bohemian and the other end definitely Saxon or Austrian, but the exact demarcation within it bothered no one.
There were only two kinds of people crossing them: invading armies and long-distance traders on very few walkable paths. The latter would be taxed prior to entering the city markets, not on the border. The former would be interested in sieging strongholds deeper in the enemy territory, not in taking a slice of wooded territory on the border.
delved
2D area is stable under increasing measurement precision.